Astra 2d in Sweden

[Lazarus]

We're missing something here ....... Free Channels are not Encrypted (Apart from a handful like Five US).

What you are probably seeing is the wide-beam regional variants of some ITV Regions etc.

All BBC Channels, plus narrow beam ITV Regional Channels, Standard Definition (but not HD) versions of ITV2,3,4, Channel 4 , Five etc are clear and unencrypted from Astra 2D.

This is permitted because the overspill outside the UK is at acceptable levels, unlike the other birds at 28.2/28.5E (which are more or less pan-European so require controls such as Encryption in many cases).

Astra 2D requires a bigger Dish than you have.

Please look at _http://www.flysat.com/28east.php


You will find all the Channels you do get are higher in frequency than 11222 and that the ones you want are those from 10714 to 10936.

Using a different Receiver won't help as the issue is dish size.

 

[Spikey10]

Ah so what my reciever is picking up is not 2d because all the free channels are encrypted, so without changing the dish which is already causing a little concern from my wife, can I do something that will get the channels I can see, like a sky box even if I have to subscribe? I have a UK address and bank etc.

 

[Topper]

The simple answer is no apart from getting the correct size dish for your location. In order to display an FTA signal you still have to have sufficient signal quality, the only way to get that is by changing the dish, there is no magic solution

 

[Spikey10]

Oh well, its just that I can see all the sky and encrypted free channels with reasonable strength but of course cant view them, I guess its back to square one a new dish. Thanks for your help

 

[Lazarus]

If you can get a Sky Box and Subscription, you should be able to see most if not all of what is on Astra 2A, 2B and Eurobird 1.


But you still won't be able to get anything from Astra 2D.

 

[Analoguesat]

The encrypted pay channels are on one of the widebeam transmission coverage areas, and can be received easily in your area. You only need a much bigger dish if you HAVE to have the BBC ITV, & C4, channels.

 

[archive10]

Oh well, its just that I can see all the sky and encrypted free channels with reasonable strength but of course cant view them, I guess its back to square one a new dish. Thanks for your help

Perhaps it's worth making it very clear: There are no free vs encrypted versions of BBC, ITV etc. They are all broadcast un-encrypted on Astra 2D. If you want these channels, you need a bigger dish. Period. No covert encrypted versions exist.

What your receiver sees may be the *announcement* of such channels, e.g. in the Sky NIT/PMT, but that's like looking in the phone book for number in China when you can't call abroad. You can see that something should be there, but you have no way of reaching it. When your receiver can't get the signal, it displays the $ sign. But it's not because it's encrypted, it's just not there.

Sorry, but dish size is king.

 

[Analoguesat]

There ARE some encrypted versions of ITV ;) - they will almost certainly move onto the Astra 1N spotbeam though in a few weeks time, and its anyones guess what recepption of THAT ONE is going to be like!

(12402V)

 

[ecosse67]

Hi!
Have read throught this thread with intrest. Am living in south central Sweden (Hjo) and have bought a Humax Foxsat digital box over from the UK with the aim to get some BBC and ITV channels.(Freesat)
I gather from what I have read that perhaps with a good dish i.e. Channel Master 1.8m and good LNB I may be able to get some service? Local Sat man has stated that to get UK tv will cost in the region of £2500 for dish, LNB and set up!!!
Any advice? Perhaps going for a Sky box with card would be easier? Very grateful for tips as I don't want to spend money getting the wrong stuff ;)

 

[archive10]

Hi!
Have read throught this thread with intrest. Am living in south central Sweden (Hjo) and have bought a Humax Foxsat digital box over from the UK with the aim to get some BBC and ITV channels.(Freesat)
I gather from what I have read that perhaps with a good dish i.e. Channel Master 1.8m and good LNB I may be able to get some service? Local Sat man has stated that to get UK tv will cost in the region of £2500 for dish, LNB and set up!!!
Any advice? Perhaps going for a Sky box with card would be easier? Very grateful for tips as I don't want to spend money getting the wrong stuff ;)

There will be no difference between Sky and Freesat for BBC/ITV/Channel4 etc. (They're using the same transponders, Sky merely include them in their bouquet.)

Although Hjo seems closer to Stockholm, is still a couple of 100 kms out, so I am not sure if you have better signal strength due to the side-lobe. My feeling is that all that is written above applies to your location too (dish, LNB, cabling etc).

Wrsp to your particular question, the CM180 will give you top notch reception of that size dish (e.g. less prone to rain-fade than smaller dishes). But you might get away with a smaller dish, there's no alternative to trying it out. But to be sure, 180 cm or more is the size you want.

2500 GBP is a bit much, except if you want to pay the installer for digging the hole, mixing concrete etc too. (A 180 cm dish requires a substantial mounting to cope with winter storms etc). A CM180 would be around 9-11000 SEK list price, the LNB, cable, connectors etc is about 1000 SEK.

A used CM180 (comes up occasionally on blocket or other e-bay equivalents) would be about 2500-4000 SEK, depending on condition etc. Buy everything else new.

Are you prepared to mount the thing yourself?

 

[ecosse67]

Thanks for that. I appreciate all the advice I can get. I think I'll have to go for the 1.8m. Was wondering however, what a 1.5m could give me in the way of channels though? I only have STV 1, 2 and TV4 at the moment so anything would be an improvement! ;-)
Was thinking of mounting it myself (with a bit of help) on the side of our house.
However this area is only 1.20m deep and it would therefore stick out a bit. This is a south facing wall which I think we be protected enough and give me the right angle for it. My other option is above our garage,
I can get behind both these walls to reinforce them for the big dish. Do you think this could work? Line of sight looks ok too.

Moderation Note

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I have done this for you this time.

 

[archive10]

Thanks for that. I appreciate all the advice I can get. I think I'll have to go for the 1.8m. Was wondering however, what a 1.5m could give me in the way of channels though? I only have STV 1, 2 and TV4 at the moment so anything would be an improvement! ;-)

As the wise people on this board have said before: "Fringe reception isn't an exact science", so it's difficult to say. But roughly, I would illustrate this hierarchically:

1) 2D or not 2D. If you can't see 2D, theres no BBC1,2,3,4,HD / ITV1,2,3,4 / Channel4,5,More4 etc. As pointed out above several times, YOU CAN however see all of what's on 2A, 2B and Eurobird1. This includes all the premium Sky Channels (i.e. sports, movies etc if you have a paid subscription) and all the, ahem, special interest channels (faith TV, shopping channels, chicks-on-a-couch, general garbage). In fact, you don't need a 150 for that - an 80 cm will do, maybe even less (e.g. good 64cm).

2) H vs V: If you are almost there with a 150, the next differentiator is between vertical and horizontal transponders (they way microwaves are sent make it possible to have various polarisations). For us in the nordics, the vertical ones are the most difficult, so you may find that the horizontal ones work, but not the vertical ones.

3) Micro-variations between transponders: some transponders are stronger, some weaker. If you are just on the bordeline, you may find that some transponders might work, while others with the same polarisation won't work. I get this even here with ITV3: with the CM180 spot-on the transponder carrying the main BBC mux (10773H), I generally can't see ITV3 or ITV3+1 (10906V) with my Foxsat.

For exact listing of what channels are on which satellite, transponder and polarisation, see e.g. lyngsat at _http://www.lyngsat.com/28east.html

(of course you can point a normal sized dish at 5W, 13 or 19.2 and get french, italian, polish and german channels if you are so inclined. )

Was thinking of mounting it myself (with a bit of help) on the side of our house.
However this area is only 1.20m deep and it would therefore stick out a bit. This is a south facing wall which I think we be protected enough and give me the right angle for it. My other option is above our garage,
I can get behind both these walls to reinforce them for the big dish. Do you think this could work? Line of sight looks ok too.

If you go for a 150cm steel or alu dish, it should be doable. If you go for an SMC (the CM180 is one such), you need a substantial L-bracket or similar, and a wall that does not mind a 100 kg sail strapped to it (ie. doesn't move/buckle). Speculating you have a timber-frame house with timber walls, I would think you need quite some re-inforcement to ensure it sticks. But fully doable, I should say. You should consult with a structural engineer, they can give qualified advice on something like this.

(Don't put it on your roof unless you have re-inforced concrete all the way up as in an industrial building. You may loose your roof! )

Other downside is that it's would be a bitch to mount and adjust when high up on a wall. The CM180 with bracket will be 100 kg or more, and is rather cumbersome to adjust when perched on a ladder (or even hanging from a window).

And just to be clear: Do. Not. Be. Tempted. To. Buy. A. Steel. Petal. Dish. (Fortec Star / Jonsa). They are waste of money for this application. (They probably work well for other people in other situations in other parts of the world, but for 2D in south sweden; forget it.)

 

[ecosse67]

Thanks very much ST1! Very comprehensive information Have seen a CM 180 on Blocket here: _http://www.blocket.se/ostergotland/Parabol_180_cm_35007036.htm?ca=13&w=2
Which seems reasonable, however, transportation could be difficult? Also not sure of condition of this but mast is included so I guess I could erect this at the back of the garden which would make adjustments easier? Must check that line of sight is ok though ;)

Unparsed URL [Admin]

 

[archive10]

yep, that's more like it. Should be somewhere around 3500-4500 SEK ultimately, if in good condition.
Condition of these things usually only dependent on mechanical damage when moving them...
...once they're mounted, not much wears on them.
(Only thing I found rusting are the bolds that hold the dish to the mount, and the mount bolts.
But a little grease will seal that up nicely.)
The one in the pic looks to be in very good condition.
Transport... well, mine went into a trailer and a minivan, respectively.
Remember to dismantle the feed holder arms before taking reflector off mount, and mount of tube.
Reflector be lifted by a single person, but really should have two people to ensure safe handling.
Mast may be good value, if it is 4.5 inch and you have a slab that it may go into.
It's clear that this guy has bolted it to his floor of his concrete balcony.
Perfect if you want to put it on a nother concrete slab (pour yurself or existing slab), but not
very useful if you want to try a wall mount.
If you just want to stick it in back of your garden, a 4.5" dia tube is not very expensive.
(Don't need the plate this guys has at his base).
Neither is concrete. See kitchscamps pics for inspiration.

PS: it's really, really p*ss*ng down there in DK right now, and I have pixelations on many
2D channels. If these summers continue like this, we may need the CM240 instead...

 

[ecosse67]

Thanks again, Will ponder this for a while and perhaps give the guy a call.
Had another question though. What are the thoughts of us getting UK TV once the Astra 1N comes into play? Is it meant to replace the Astra D?

 

[archive10]

Replace 2D? Yes (at least it will take over transponders). When? Opinions vary.

Effective footprint? Nobody really knows. The official footprint seems roughly the same, if only slightly more sharper cut-off.
But it may remove some of the sidelobes from, say the Stockholm area, or certain parts of Spain.

There's plenty of discussion in other threads on this forum on that particular topic.

 

[gavman]

Has anyone else had problems since BBC changed over to Astra N1? I lost BBC1,BBC2, still have ITV. Is it just allignment or am I screwed?

 

[Analoguesat]

There are certainly problems receiving Astra 1N in the Stockholm area - it all depends on the dish size - do a forum search for Stockholm - there has been a lot of discussion in recent weeks.

 

[PaulR]

It appears that even moving from south to north of Stockholm there is a difference but basically, you will need a larger dish, say about 1.5m. If you can afford a 1.8m dish (and have the ability/permission/land) then this would be better.

But whether that will still be good enough when 1N gives way to 2F in the next twelve months or so is anyone's guess.

 

[DannySTHLM]

Did some tests today in Stockholm.

Transponder 10773H
Satlook micro hd
Clear skyes

Channelmaster 120cm, cm feedhorn and inverto redline quad C120 LNB: No lock

Channelmaster 120cm, Inverto Black Ultra single LNB: SNR 6,1dB

Prodelin offset 180cm, cm feedhorn and inverto redline quad C120 LNB: SNR 8,2dB

Prime Focus 205cm, invacom feedhorn and inverto redline quad C120 LNB: SNR 9,7dB

The black ultra is obviously better then a matched feedhorn but a 120cm dish is simply too small.
Cant wait until they make a black ultra C120 LNB.
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