DVB Dream(?!?)

[satesco]

I tried in vain to post on the DVB Dream forum a response to the decision of @rel, the developer of DVB Dream, who has decided to switch to an annual payment system, a kind of subscription for his application, DVB Dream. Unfortunately without success.

That's why, with the permission of the admin of this forum, I hope to post here a message to the Turkish developer, in the hope that he will listen to the feedback of those who paid years ago and use his application, and now they have to pay again at a rather steep price this annual subscription. Maybe someone will bring out to @rel to read what these users say on this forum or others.

I won't go into the technical details of this DVB player, which can be discussed pro and con by those who use it, but I find the price, $79 for beginners and 49 euros per year, exaggerated compared to other DVB players, some of which, like DVBViewer, ProgDVB, are regularly updated and offer multiple features without charging users an extra price or subscription. Not to say that there are plenty of players, like AltDVB, SmartDVB that are offered for free and that meet the requirements of regular users, even DX-ers.

For this reason I do not understand what is the logic of this developer, who in his desire to maximize a substantial income (?), up to a point is understandable, sabotages himself the interests and purpose that he has proposed!!!
I could bring many arguments as a user for @rel's decision, but, I express the hope that he will read the reaction of old users on various forums, most of them disappointed, by his decision to institute an annual subscription.

It seems that he has not understood the message of those who said five years ago that a decision to increase the price on his app is not desirable except within certain limits that will suit those interested in the player. Unfortunately, after so many years of silence, during which time he did not ensure the support of DVB Dream, he has found it is right to raise the price. He didn't realize that in order to charge such an annual fee, his player must be a MUST for users. As much as I would like to claim such status, so to speak, DVB Dream is not at this level...

Although I don't wish him that, but the only consequence of his decision to increase the price for his app is that he will lose old users, let alone gain new ones. He probably knows that in market economics and competition, the fool is not the one who asks, but the one who buys. But why he is doing this, I don't understand, except with the illusion that there will be such buyers who don't know what his app offers.

Here's what the message looks like after you launch the player. It's like announcing the demise of a player that was still alive, but which the "father" of this player wants to bury it with his hands, sorry, with his "mind".

 

[Channel Hopper]

Not having looked at the product for years, how many members are using the DVBDream forum and what cost would be involved in hosting/managing it ?

 

[satesco]

Not having looked at the product for years, how many members are using the DVBDream forum and what cost would be involved in hosting/managing it ?

Of course, I cannot answer how many users, on this forum or elsewhere, use DVB Dream. I was just one of them. So I don't know more. But I am only intrigued by @rel's idea that he could benefit more if he resorted to an annual subscription, especially as for many years our developer has not bothered to update his application. What's more, he didn't answer the questions these users were asking on his own forum.

But to your legitimate question about how much it costs to maintain a host, the developer of this application should answer you. But I don't think he won't answer you, nor any other developer, because he would have to go into details that don't concern a buyer/user. All these things are in his kitchen. And I can assume they are not small expenses that only he knows how to manage if he wants to stay on the "market".

I would think that from such a developer's perspective, these things are very important if he wants to be technically and economically relevant to those interested in his product. Or what we see, is that over the years, DVB applications have multiplied as DVB cards have implemented new features that ordinary receivers did not have.

The developers who have created DVB players and apps have realized that the market for DVB cards, or rather, the money made from selling their app is not as big and popular as they thought. That's why some of them gave up for good, the one who created the 4t2 Content Analyzer app, or stopped charging for its use, Christian, the engineer of EBSpro, who finally offered it for free to anyone who wants to use it.

In short, in most cases, the developers of these DVB applications realize that the market is not big enough to make a big profit from licensing their application. They probably keep it at a survival price for running expenses. I am thinking of ProgDVB or DVBViewer, but I don't think the only benefit for those who offer their app for free is rather one of esteem and reputation. They are defending their application because they have invested so many neurons and personal involvement that they remain known in our memory with their application and not after what they do now, when they earn their living from other commands that have nothing to do with their original passion.

And let's not forget an essential reason why a DVB application developer has no chance to "thrive" just by selling licenses. I think most of them are not required to cooperate with a manufacturer of DVB cards or receivers, from which they at least make a salary. The development of these applications are the expression, I believe, of an extraordinary intellectual capacity that such people, and those with such skills, have been willing to put to the test, i.e. they have made a bet with themselves. I can give examples of such people, but I don't think this is the case. Some of them we find on this forum.

Unfortunately, @rel, the author of DVB Dream, is a little/much out of touch with what is happening in the DVB card market, but especially what users want at this stage of satellite broadcasting.
We have all, regardless of the device and application we use, entered the IPTV broadcasting era. This has led to a reduction in the number of satellite broadcasting enthusiasts, which forces device manufacturers, but at the same time also developers, to take this trend into account.

I'll stop here, because not at this long exposition about the maintenance and involvement of a DVB application developer would you like a short and pertinent answer. I apologize for subjecting you to this perhaps inappropriate verbiage.

 

[moonbase]

That DVB Dream developer is greedy.

He failed to support his product for years, deleted any posts with criticism from his forum for what was an unreliable product.
I hope he gets no or very little in subscription fees, he does not deserve it.

 

[wellikan]

I would recommend everyone to use these AltDVB and SmartDVB, they are quite decent players.

 

[satesco]

That DVB Dream developer is greedy.

He failed to support his product for years, deleted any posts with criticism from his forum for what was an unreliable product.
I hope he gets no or very little in subscription fees, he does not deserve it.

I didn't want to use such a harsh word, greedy, which in fact confirms the decision he made. Worse than that, the new version,3.73, after which he sets up the subscription, does not come with a massive update, including other functionalities that the previous versions, say, T2-MI, or or subtitling, do not have.

I don't want to diminish a developer's effort to improve his application no matter how he does it, but we can't ignore the fact that other DVB Dream features are based on @CrazyCat's library, like blindscan. There are also DVB players based on this library that were offered for free, see SmartDVB, but I wonder, more rhetorically, are these developers paying to @CrazyCat to use his files? I don't think that our good Ukrainian colleague is demanding, even for a modest amount, that these developers pay him.

What is unacceptable in the case of this developer, is that he does not allow old payers to use his application at the version they have been using for years, but has to start from scratch. It is an affront, an offense, if you will, to them that he doesn't care about them. Unless he wants to lose them too. Their reaction to @rel's decision expresses the idea of giving up DVBDream. Is that what he wants?

He draws the conclusion if he reads the posts here and on other forums. As they say, every bird dies on its own tongue.

 

[anto@]

honestly I used it very but very little, even with the various cracks that were around at the time it is a good average player, but it has never taken 1 € and never will take it so even if it disappears it doesn't matter that much
I spent some time ago on ebs pro which then even becomes free, unlike dvb dream, and then I bought dvb viewer which honestly I will have used 10 times in 20 years, also this program is a bit brainless in case of new scans or insertions of TP feed
so my choice 20 years ago fell on ALT DVB and since then I use it 99.9999999% and every now and then I use smart dvb
so whether it is there or not doesn't matter to me, furthermore I consider this tax something beyond any logic, I can understand the one-off cost but annual NO

 

[Analoguesat]

Before getting too critical of the software developer lets remember that many many other services are going down the subscription route, and if the developer thinks he can get an income from his creation - thats entirely up to him.

However it is ALSO entirely up to existing & future users to decide if they want to pay the desired subscription or switch to a different piece of software.... If hes misjudged the subscription price then no one will take him up on it.

 

[Channel Hopper]

Of course, I cannot answer how many users, on this forum or elsewhere, use DVB Dream. I was just one of them. So I don't know more. But I am only intrigued by @rel's idea that he could benefit more if he resorted to an annual subscription, especially as for many years our developer has not bothered to update his application. What's more, he didn't answer the questions these users were asking on his own forum.

But to your legitimate question about how much it costs to maintain a host, the developer of this application should answer you. But I don't think he won't answer you, nor any other developer, because he would have to go into details that don't concern a buyer/user. All these things are in his kitchen. And I can assume they are not small expenses that only he knows how to manage if he wants to stay on the "market".

I would think that from such a developer's perspective, these things are very important if he wants to be technically and economically relevant to those interested in his product. Or what we see, is that over the years, DVB applications have multiplied as DVB cards have implemented new features that ordinary receivers did not have.

The developers who have created DVB players and apps have realized that the market for DVB cards, or rather, the money made from selling their app is not as big and popular as they thought. That's why some of them gave up for good, the one who created the 4t2 Content Analyzer app, or stopped charging for its use, Christian, the engineer of EBSpro, who finally offered it for free to anyone who wants to use it.

In short, in most cases, the developers of these DVB applications realize that the market is not big enough to make a big profit from licensing their application. They probably keep it at a survival price for running expenses. I am thinking of ProgDVB or DVBViewer, but I don't think the only benefit for those who offer their app for free is rather one of esteem and reputation. They are defending their application because they have invested so many neurons and personal involvement that they remain known in our memory with their application and not after what they do now, when they earn their living from other commands that have nothing to do with their original passion.

And let's not forget an essential reason why a DVB application developer has no chance to "thrive" just by selling licenses. I think most of them are not required to cooperate with a manufacturer of DVB cards or receivers, from which they at least make a salary. The development of these applications are the expression, I believe, of an extraordinary intellectual capacity that such people, and those with such skills, have been willing to put to the test, i.e. they have made a bet with themselves. I can give examples of such people, but I don't think this is the case. Some of them we find on this forum.

Unfortunately, @rel, the author of DVB Dream, is a little/much out of touch with what is happening in the DVB card market, but especially what users want at this stage of satellite broadcasting.
We have all, regardless of the device and application we use, entered the IPTV broadcasting era. This has led to a reduction in the number of satellite broadcasting enthusiasts, which forces device manufacturers, but at the same time also developers, to take this trend into account.

I'll stop here, because not at this long exposition about the maintenance and involvement of a DVB application developer would you like a short and pertinent answer. I apologize for subjecting you to this perhaps inappropriate verbiage.

Nothing to apologise I can assure you.

My next question would have been if you provided input on DVBDream beyond feedback via their forum ?
There are many levels on this, this space can only accomodate a certain number.

 

[satesco]

I am not talking about the number of DVB Dream users. Nor am I interested in this aspect of the problem, whether there are 10 or, 10000 users. As a user I am interested in buying a product in relation to price and quality, in this case if the player is worth it. I am willing to spend more money than I have done so far. I am not against this increase, especially as I appreciate some qualities of DVB Dream.

The question is for the developer to know if his application is viable, either from a commercial gain point of view, or if it is worth to maintain the server with the money from the licensing or from his personal money. It is the latter motivation that is the most appropriate in the decision such an entrepreneur makes when going to market.
Maybe that's why @rel asked on his forum if the users of his app are willing to increase the amount they pay. And I can understand that he wants to raise the price on his application, because to maintain a server without a minimum revenue is a nonsense, unless you are a philanthropist, or a hopeless romantic.

I wish I could tell @rel directly what I wrote on this forum. Unfortunately, he doesn't seem to care what his app users say if they can't express their opinions on the DVB Dream forum. I wonder if I am the only one in this situation. That's why I took the liberty to write here what I had to say, knowing that I was more entitled to express myself on the forum of the developer Turk.

And I'm glad that this UK forum is more tolerant both with other users, but also with the topics brought by them. And I took the liberty to take advantage of this availability, you could call it English. It's no coincidence that those who want to say whatever they want to do in Hyde Park, where famous orators and politicians have freely expressed their opinions.

 

[Analoguesat]

As you know we are fairly lenient here as long as discussion stays away from politics & illegal decryption of pay tv services.

If dissenting discussion is censored on other forums then you need to ask yourself if you want to be part of a community that doesnt permit dissentng opinions..

 

[pontiend]

I have always used DVB dream.I paid for the licience many years ago.It annoys the hell out of me that they want me to pay a subcription for something that I paid for years ago.

 

[SatSearcher]

I used to use DVB Dream a few years ago (it was still free at the time), then I found SmartDVB. I used both for a while, but realized SmartDVB was a superior product (in my opinion, maybe others will disagree!) I still use SmartDVB today, and it's still free. It does everything I need it to do, so don't know why I would need to pay for a different product which mostly does the exact same thing!

 

[EnoSat]

Personally, I think that the DVBdream project is no longer led by rreloc (he went silent in 2019 after the release of v3.7.1), but by one of his partners.

 

[Analoguesat]

I have always used DVB dream.I paid for the licience many years ago.It annoys the hell out of me that they want me to pay a subcription for something that I paid for years ago.

That is a common trick these days - any number of software organisations have done EXACTLY the same. Simply because why have a one off payment from a punter when you can have a recurring regular income from the sucker consumer.

Customer loyalty over many years means NOTHING these days.

 

[scopus]

I have always used DVB dream.I paid for the licience many years ago.It annoys the hell out of me that they want me to pay a subcription for something that I paid for years ago.

Acronis have done the same..

 

[Channel Hopper]

I am not talking about the number of DVB Dream users. Nor am I interested in this aspect of the problem, whether there are 10 or, 10000 users. As a user I am interested in buying a product in relation to price and quality, in this case if the player is worth it. I am willing to spend more money than I have done so far. I am not against this increase, especially as I appreciate some qualities of DVB Dream.

The question is for the developer to know if his application is viable, either from a commercial gain point of view, or if it is worth to maintain the server with the money from the licensing or from his personal money. It is the latter motivation that is the most appropriate in the decision such an entrepreneur makes when going to market.
Maybe that's why @rel asked on his forum if the users of his app are willing to increase the amount they pay. And I can understand that he wants to raise the price on his application, because to maintain a server without a minimum revenue is a nonsense, unless you are a philanthropist, or a hopeless romantic.

I wish I could tell @rel directly what I wrote on this forum. Unfortunately, he doesn't seem to care what his app users say if they can't express their opinions on the DVB Dream forum. I wonder if I am the only one in this situation. That's why I took the liberty to write here what I had to say, knowing that I was more entitled to express myself on the forum of the developer Turk.

And I'm glad that this UK forum is more tolerant both with other users, but also with the topics brought by them. And I took the liberty to take advantage of this availability, you could call it English. It's no coincidence that those who want to say whatever they want to do in Hyde Park, where famous orators and politicians have freely expressed their opinions.

Hyde Park (other Corners are available), and Parliament Square have not been true free speech areas for years, the police can and will take away props and move people on.

 

[satesco]

Pity.
It is a different England now than it was in the 19th century and the first half of the 20th. Any change in a country's history does nothing but destroy even the greatest myths that people have. Fortunately the myths, depending on how they are seen, for better or worse, do not match the reality.
The only hope we have, those of us who visit you online from other parts of the globe, is that this forum doesn't have what you describe as Hyde Park now.
That we are allowed to each have a "stool" from which to be heard, of course respecting the rules of this forum, reminded above by @Analoguesat.