Bizarre ..silly ..or Just Plain Daft ?

[Vipersan]

Just noticed you online..Nelson
Did you have a try for the testcard I posted (18west) ?
Posted this morning in the testcards thread ..
It may well be doable on a 1.8
its 8db approx
rgds

 

[aceb]

..and its got one of those nasty continental 2 pin plugs on it ..
..and no adapter..as per.

And no poking a screwdriver in the earth socket then wedging in the Shuko plug ;)

Do you still need the angles, sorry I'm a bit late back today, too many errands to do this afternoon!

I notice you've no spacers between the Gibby and the Moteck adapter bracket so I'm guessing you've no declination adjustment on the dish? I didn't have enough movement on my adapter plate and TBH the nicest feature on the Gib is the threaded bar that allows really fine tuning of the angle so I spaced the dish away from the metalwork.

 

[nelson_b]

Just noticed you online..Nelson
Did you have a try for the testcard I posted (18west) ?
Posted this morning in the testcards thread ..
It may well be doable on a 1.8
its 8db approx
rgds

hi -
was online briefly earlier -- but only just seen this post tonight.

So given it a go -- and yes no problem receiving it -- thanks -- over 8db for me here also

cheers ---

 

[Vipersan]

Nope ..decided to forgo the gibbys declination adjustment in favour of a straight bolt-to-plate method ...replacing the U bolts with straight stainless ones..

BUT ..although I can get close ...its still not close enough ..

Still cannot get sufficient declination ..so the whole assembly has been dismantled again ..whilst I look into this problem..

This is the solution I think might work ...but its not easy as it requires much filing of that thick steel adapter plate..

Problem is actually using the bolt holes in the bottom lip of the H180..

It simply wont line up with the plate holes ..so am currently filing out at a right angle to the key slot ..so the bottom edge of the plate will actually mount a bit further in toward the motor..

Not the clearest of pics ..with the flash on ..but its getting dark ..so filing suspended till tomorrow..

rgds

VS

 

[Llew]

Yes, that's what Mickha and myself had to do (see #56 here) -

http://www.satellites.co.uk/forums/...up-moteck-h180-gtp-1800am-36v-hh-motor-6.html

incidentally, my Gibby dish doesn't have an Az/El bracket like yours, so I had to pack out the bottom bracket of my SMW PM with a piece of metal (size found by trial and error) between the PM bracket and dish to obtain the correct declination.

 

[Vipersan]

..Simple question ...how accurate is placing an inclinometer on the lnb arm of a Gibby ?
Say for example I want to point the Gibby at 0.8W ..
The elevation at my location is just short of 30 degrees ..
because of the fact that I no longer have the Gibbys built in declination active ..
Can I just place an inclinometer on the lnb arm ...? ..and how accurate would it be ?

due to the construction method used to decline the dish ..there are now 3 variables ...so I'm choosing to use the inclinometer approach.
rgds
VS

 

[Llew]

Well if it's any help VS, my Gibby's arm is 26° from the horizontal at 0.8°W, and the dish is tracking the arc OK.

 

[aceb]

Not sure this will help if you can't control the declination Evan but I've just measured these two angles using the inclinometer on my phone and with the dish pointing due south. I've calibrated against the main pole which is strung so errors should be minimal.

 

[Vipersan]

Thanks for thae angles guys ..

This morning I took a file and an angle grinder to this damned US configured adapter plate ..

The blue bits are now removed ..

..allowing more tilt and use of the bottom pivot holes and original bolts ..

So we start again tomorrow ...where the angles you posted will prove very useful I suspect.

rgds

VS


Oops posted the plate image with the right angled slot pointing the wrong way .

Now corrected..

 

[Vipersan]

..Too dark to see outside now so gave up for the day ..
I can honestly say this is more trouble to set up than the ginormous polar mount on the 1.8pf
I have had it sort of tracking from 1 west to astra at 28 east ..but still not accurate and although I know the max I can get at 1west now is 15.3db (F15) ..
The signal down at 28 east is little better than 9db...so still not tracking the arc correctly ...and nothing at all down at 36 east..
Its all guesswork ..as you cannot use the setup table provided ..due to the mods made to the extension plate assembly.
The very _useful_ (not) azimuth angle scale is just where you need it most ...black on black on the underside of the motor ..and not even sure of its accuracy ?
Without tipping up the motor ..what do each of those marks on the scale represent ?
It doesn't say in the manual ..and my eyes aren't good enough to see ..upside down..
I suspect I have enough declination adjustment now ..but hard to tell as yet.
I don't doubt this is doable...but it's certainly not easy when the only thing you can be sure of is pointing the motor South
My theory is fwiw ..just keep tweaking the motor elevation at 0.8W ..and the declination at about 30 East ..and theory says it should follow the arc assuming its all pointing South to start with.
The battle continues tomorrow..
rgds
VS

 

[Mickha]

In the USA the motor looks to be almost vertical, so the scale is easy to view, not so in the UK.
Same goes with the adapter brackets, in the UK we need them at the top, in the US they have them attached to the bottom, hence the problem with bottom holes, and the adapter plate.
I'm sure it is possible but it does take a lot of messing about, and a lot of time.
Keep at it VS, I'm sure you'll come up with an ingenious solution

Had a couple of thoughts, from viewing one of your pictures. Can you raise/lower the elevation of the dish, using the gibertini adjuster, circled red, then use the motor elevation, circled green, to peak the signal on 0.8W?
View attachment 44539

Also what have you got the motor adjustment scale set to, the one on the top, I think it ranges from 1-8?

 

[Vipersan]

In the USA the motor looks to be almost vertical, so the scale is easy to view, not so in the UK.

Same goes with the adapter brackets, in the UK we need them at the top, in the US they have them attached to the bottom, hence the problem with bottom holes, and the adapter plate.

I'm sure it is possible but it does take a lot of messing about, and a lot of time.

Keep at it VS, I'm sure you'll come up with an ingenious solution


Had a couple of thoughts, from viewing one of your pictures. Can you raise/lower the elevation of the dish, using the gibertini adjuster, circled red, then use the motor elevation, circled green, to peak the signal on 0.8W?

View attachment 44539


Also what have you got the motor adjustment scale set to, the one on the top, I think it ranges from 1-8?

Sadly no ..the gibbys elevation adjustment is redundant now ...and no idea what the scales currently read on the other adjustments ..but I'll take a look tomorrow.

I'm using a combination of the the 2 lock nuts that pivot the motor ..and the threaded bar that passes through a metal block to adjust elevation ...and the motor top scale adjuster for declination...

rgds

VS

 

[Mickha]

No doubt there will be a lot of trial, and error, tomorrow then, at least the weather should be good
You can also try with the two extenders set to maximum distance, then try them at minimum, and see how the arc tracks.

 

[Vipersan]

No doubt there will be a lot of trial, and error, tomorrow then, at least the weather should be good

You can also try with the two extenders set to maximum distance, then try them at minimum, and see how the arc tracks.

View attachment 44544

Currently the extenders are at maximum...as anything else just introduces another variable..

My basic understanding of polar mounts and arc tracking is that there should be only 2 variables ..to avoid errors..

see my much simplified diagram..

certainly there are only 2 variables on the PF polar mount ..the only difference being the azimuth is driven external to the centre ..whereas the H180 is internal and at the centre.


This all assumes your mount/motor is pointing due South to start with.

rgds

VS

 

[Mickha]

With mine I can currently get all the satellites, that I've tried, from 42E to 30W, but it still isn't tracking the arc 100% correctly. This could be because I had to drill 2 holes, to get the adapter plate to fit, and I might have pushed it too far forward, limiting the top adjusters ability to compensate sufficiently to allow perfect tracking.
When I have time, I will take it down, and attempt to get it working correctly, but I'm using a Channel Master 1.2M dish, with no other options to alter the dish, unlike one I saw, using the Gibertinis elevation adjustment, which apparently worked, in getting the motor to track the arc.
It might only require a few minor adjustments, to get mine working perfectly, but based on my last attempts it was very fiddly, and everytime I tried gently moving the motors top adjuster the extender brackets slipped forward. I was getting closer when I ran out of sunny weather.
At the moment I'm spending all my free time sorting out the rear garden, which is all clay, so difficult to dig, and full of weeds.
If I had my way, it would all be paved over, and then I could create a dish farm !!!!!!

 

[Vipersan]

Hi Mickha ..
I'm keeping the option to use the Gibbys adjuster as a last resort as it would require the making of 2 brackets to allow free movement..
If all else fails I'll go down this route..but in truth ..and although the motors EL and DE adjustments are crude and clumsy ...they should work ..if enough wovement is possible.
Its all a bit hit n miss with this motor ..and the pic on the front of the manual shows it driving a PF ...not an offset...so the elevation is automatically set higher to start with.
rgds
VS

 

[Mickha]

I agree, it should be possible, but if you're not lucky, and stumble on the correct settings, it could take time, and patience, to get it working correctly.
Any chance you can please keep some records, of your progress, to check later. Maximum signal quality you can get on the TV2 PL HD channels, on 0.8W, then as you move along the arc, using the motor, to peak the signal for 5E, 7E, 10E, 13E, 16E, 19.2E, 23.5E, 26E, 28.2E, to check the signal quality readings.
I seem to recall you were even having problems with 28.2E, did you have to increase the elevation, or decrease it, to improve the signal, or didn't you check?

 

[Vipersan]

I agree, it should be possible, but if you're not lucky, and stumble on the correct settings, it could take time, and patience, to get it working correctly.
Any chance you can please keep some records, of your progress, to check later. Maximum signal quality you can get on the TV2 PL HD channels, on 0.8W, then as you move along the arc, using the motor, to peak the signal for 5E, 7E, 10E, 13E, 16E, 19.2E, 23.5E, 26E, 28.2E, to check the signal quality readings.
I seem to recall you were even having problems with 28.2E, did you have to increase the elevation, or decrease it, to improve the signal, or didn't you check?

No progress yet ..as it was getting dark last night ..all tweaking had to stop.
Not started again as yet ..
Slow getting me 'into gear'.. this morning thanks to the MS..
rgds
VS

 

[Vipersan]

Ok ...all set up outside ..F15 and positioner in place..
Strong cuppa Tea to hand ;)
I thought I'd begin by checking results as they were left last night..
28 east is there but lowish signal ..
0.8 at the top of the arc is at max signal ..
So thought I'd check my azimuth by seeing what I could get as it is currently ...to the west..
began with Fransat at 5 west ...no probs
Moved on to Huntinton Beach at 22 west ..
There it was ..then on to Overon on Hispasat ..
Again it was there at around 10db..
as with the sats east of 28 deg ...this appears to be the limit currently ...as a try for RASD at 45 west showed nowt..
Time to start declination adjustments methinks...
But not bad for my first attempt..
It does look like I have the azimuth set fairly accurately..

from what I remember from the old days ..
decline a little at the extremes of the arc ..and compensate by elevating mount/motor a little ..to shape the arc ..
Slowly slowly catchee monkee
rgds
VS

 

[Mickha]

Take it easy VS, it's actually warm here, bordering on hot !!!!!!
Just spent a couple of hours digging up clay, and rubble, until I ran out of heavy duty garden refuse bags, another 20 used before I knew it !!!!!!!
Now all I can do is mow the lawn/weeds, and a bit of tidying up.
Never had this problem, at my old place, it was similar to yours, all paving slabs, and concrete, much easier to look after.
So far I hate gardening, it just never seems to stop, next summer, if we have one, I will have to hire a rotavator, level everything off and re-turf it. Hopefully that will make it much easier to maintain, as I prefer just vegetating, wathcing football, and cricket, instead of being boiled alive gardening