Eastern sats after 33e

[Manikm909]

Hey guys

i "sort of" ground mounted (combo mount, wall mount \ and pole on ground) my dish on Sunday - technically its wall mounted i guess.

all went well, however, i have lost the extreme East sats....the line of sight is not great now that its ground mounted, so this is probably why

i notice as the dish arcs it starts to point more down than up.

are the east sats low in the sky compared to west? (Whcih i can pick up fine up to 45w, maybe beyond)

would there be any merit in raising the dish by 1metre, which i could do - i dont want to go any higher, as i dont want to bother with ladders anymore...

 

[jeallen01]

Pictures might help people to advise???

 

[Manikm909]

thanks i'll grab some later

 

[ozumo]

If your longitude was 0°, 45E & 45W would have the same elevation - eastern satellites aren't lower.

If the elevation of a sat is 22.50° and the obstacle is 10M high you'd need to be 20M away to clear it (45 / 22.5 = 2, so 2x as far back as obstacle is high). If you raised the dish a metre you'd only need to be 18M away as the obstacle would be 9M.

 

[moonbase]

As a generalisation, raising the dish in a built up area would hopefully improve the arc.
However, it depends on the nature and proximity of any obstacles to your line of sight as to the level of improvement.

As suggested by "jeallen01", pictures of the line of sight would help.
You can use the dishpointer app with the obstacle blocker. It gives an rough guide to work with.

I have attached below a small table I created a few years ago, some of the the satellites are out of date and the angles are approximate but still valid.
The table should be reasonably close for most of the London/Surrey area. It might give you a guide as to the line of sight angles for 36.0E and beyond?

For an offset focus dish you will need to account for the dish offset angle if using the dish face as an alignment angle.

.

 

[nelson_b]

Examples of offset dish and prime focus dish at 68.5 e ...The lowest i can see at my location in the north west of the u.k. ....... 2.4 degrees of elevation .

 

[Manikm909]

thanks all
i just dont think theres enough clearance between dish and obstacle
33e is ok, but after that nothing

 

[Manikm909]

33e is ok, but after that nothing

Examples of offset dish and prime focus dish at 68.5 e ...The lowest i can see at my location in the north west of the u.k. ....... 2.4 degrees of elevation .

View attachment 136713 View attachment 136714

lol i cant beleive that OFFSET one gets a signal - is the floor sending the signal?

 

[nelson_b]

lol i cant beleive that OFFSET one gets a signal - is the floor sending the signal?

Yes ..they look odd - certainly ... really shows the difference with offset .. when they don,t point directly at the satellite as the prime focus does.
68 E is literally on the horizon from here ..... not many places where i can actually see that sat here, due to buildings and trees etc.

 

[Channel Hopper]

If your latitude was 0°, 45E & 45W would have the same elevation - eastern satellites aren't lower.

Longitude ? (though the original wording is also correct)

 

[Lazarus]

Thanks yes longitude is what I should have said

I would be grateful if you could make me look slightly less stupid by correcting the original post.

Done

 

[Manikm909]

pictures as promised - dish set to 45e - i can get signal up to 33e at around 9db

in pic2 - im thinking of raising it higher by 1m and moving it more to left....

 

[jeallen01]

FWIW, if the roof of your garage is fairly solid and can take a bit of weight, I'd be inclined to raise the dish more than 1m and up to a height where it can swing East over the top of the garage.

OK, that would mean that a bit of ladder work would be required, but you could then hopefully sit/stand on the roof when making adjustments to the dish & motor.

 

[moonbase]

FWIW, if the roof of your garage is fairly solid and can take a bit of weight, I'd be inclined to raise the dish more than 1m and up to a height where it can swing East over the top of the garage.

OK, that would mean that a bit of ladder work would be required, but you could then hopefully sit/stand on the roof when making adjustments to the dish & motor.

+1
Agreed, to get a decent bit more arc to the East beyond 33.0E I think the dish needs to be raised so that the entire dish face has clear line of sight above your garage fascia.
I do not think that raising the dish by 1 metre will achieve this.

Without knowing the height and distance away of the tree shown in picture 3 you cannot calculate if it is a line of sight obstacle.
The dishpointer app has a distance measure to obstacles, if you check out your exact location you might get an idea of how tall the tree needs to be to block your line of sight?


If the garage roof is sturdy enough to take the weight you could look for a tripod mount or NPRM and anchor it down with paving slabs or kerbstones for a garage roof install.

Alternatively, you could keep it ground mounted but move it further away from the garage wall into the lawn area or close to where the block paving meets the lawn.
Obviously, this may not be an option due to aesthetic reasons with the dish sited in the middle of the garden.

 

[a33]

But do check the elevation angle of the top of the trees!
Would be bad, if you moved the dish and couldn't 'see' the satellites anyway.

Alas, sunoutage time is a few months away now. You'd need to do the 'manual' work....

Greetz,
A33

 

[Manikm909]

thanks all, well I took the plunge and raised it and moved it further left, used a longer pole - the good news is i can now get 39e - "3 Plus" channel coming in at 15.2db

BUT if i goto 42e, or beyond then i get nothing AT ALL!

i might raise the pole a bit higher, or trim those reed type plants (my side) - i'd be happy with 42e and 45e without the need of ladders.

glad i moved it now though.

im surprised, i get nothing at all on 42e, when im getting 15.2db on 39e

edit: hmm - getting 17db on ABC NEWS - how can it dip so suddenly

 

[Lazarus]

thanks all, well I took the plunge and raised it and moved it further left, used a longer pole - the good news is i can now get 39e - "3 Plus" channel coming in at 15.2db

BUT if i goto 42e, or beyond then i get nothing AT ALL!

i might raise the pole a bit higher, or trim those reed type plants (my side) - i'd be happy with 42e and 45e without the need of ladders.

glad i moved it now though.

im surprised, i get nothing at all on 42e, when im getting 15.2db on 39e

My own obstacles also mean 39E is aok, yet 42E is no go. But I can get 52E very well and it actually carries some good stuff.

Lots of Cricket and Association Football FTA with Engerlish Commentary, for example.

 

[jeallen01]

thanks all, well I took the plunge and raised it and moved it further left, used a longer pole - the good news is i can now get 39e - "3 Plus" channel coming in at 15.2db

BUT if i goto 42e, or beyond then i get nothing AT ALL!

i might raise the pole a bit higher, or trim those reed type plants (my side) - i'd be happy with 42e and 45e without the need of ladders.

glad i moved it now though.

im surprised, i get nothing at all on 42e, when im getting 15.2db on 39e

edit: hmm - getting 17db on ABC NEWS - how can it dip so suddenly

MUCH higher WILL be better! - see my post, and then that by @moonbase, earlier today because @Lazarus is totally correct in saying that 52E is the "place to be" for the content that he mentioned

 

[Manikm909]

thanks i know higher will be better, i wanted to get away with moving the dish away from a place where i had to climb ladder to mess about with dish after strong winds....

i had two options:

1. live with it and adjust everytime dish blows out (risking severe injury everytime)
2. move dish to a different lower position (no ladders involved) - easy to maintain \ change LNB etc, no risk.

my option 2 has worked out, BUT it looks like im going to be sacrifcing 42, 45e, 52e, and 53e...

do i just accept that and move on with life?

OR do i bother raising the new location higher, meaning ladders again!!! (I may has well left it in original location)

again OR, do i put dish back to old location, again, ladders and possible injury - BUT instead, replace current dish with the CM on polar mount along with actuator (and vbox) and do away with DISEQ motors forever.

because in theory once its up, its up, and wind shouldnt blow it out of position ever again...id only ever need to replace LNB maybe....

im in a complete dilema....

 

[Manikm909]

i forgot i hadnt uploaded pics of update location, maybe i just go higher where it is with CM and polar mount it.

THIS IS DISH AT 53e