poor Freesat in Alicante, Costa Blanca 2.4m Fortec Star dish

[guest poster]

Thanks for taking that trouble...

…at first glance .. they all look wrong.. (wouldn't surprise me too much) unless someone is supplying LNBf's with integral feed horns with an f/d ratio of c.38 not .6.

1# = quad or quattro Invacom .3 LNBf with an f/d of… .6
2# = quad or quattro Invacom .3 LNBf with an f/d of… .6
3# = quad or quattro ???? Very blurred but looks like another Invacom .3 LNBf with an f/d of… .6
4# = quad or quattro (not sure brand) LNBf with an f/d of… .6

All four should be the C120 LNB equivalents (quad or Quattro) with either C120 flanged (.38) matched feed horns or adjustable feed horns set at .38. Unless someone is making Invacom LNBf’ copies with f/d ratios of .38 or whatever ratio…

What they all want is one of them.. (the C120s)

_http://www.globalinvacom.com/products/dbsquad.php (Quad C120)

Or

_http://www.globalinvacom.com/products/dbsquatro.php (Quattro C120).

And one of them…

_http://www.globalinvacom.com/products/adjustablefeedhorn.php set to .38

They are all losing loads of signal and might as well have a smaller offset…
Maybe they are all set back of the focal point and that’s how the signal is getting in- still not right.

Some of the feed support arms don’t look 100% either.

mind you.. I've ad a few so could be all booze b#ll*cks

Anyone else want to play... guess the LNB…

 

[PaulR]

Well..

No 2 doesn't look as though it's pointing to the centre of the dish to me!

 

[woborny]

no 3 looks like an invacom c120 with feedhorn....the one you want for your "fortecs-argh" dish

it also looks like a famaval 2.4m dish, judging by the plastic LNB holder, and the angle that the support arms are...the support arms / poles also look different to the other 3 photos...

 

[guest poster]

Other evidence on the blurred number three is it's the only one that isn't pushed so far forward to the shoulder.... as a feed horn would get the focal length too... the other three LNBfs probably can't get near enough to get the the focal point either - bizarrely that might help a little with a .6 on a .38 dish.. or not. The feed horn on 3 looks small though.

BTW .. Happy New Year all... ... and my head's still in 2008 ... where's that coffee...

 

[guest poster]

So what's wrong with this picture... answers on a postcard to ...

_http://www.maplin.co.uk/Module.aspx?ModuleNo=97081&TabID=1&QV=Y&C=EBook&U=Ecat


oh, and I like this ...

_http://ebook.maplin.co.uk/maplinlargeebook/enter.html?page=310



try clicking on the c120 with feed horn...

I wonder if that's why 4 fortec star 2.4s have ....invacom lnbfs...

 

[Robbo]

So what's wrong with this picture... answers on a postcard to ...

_http://www.maplin.co.uk/Module.aspx?ModuleNo=97081&TabID=1&QV=Y&C=EBook&U=Ecat


oh, and I like this ...

_http://ebook.maplin.co.uk/maplinlargeebook/enter.html?page=310



try clicking on the c120 with feed horn...

I wonder if that's why 4 fortec star 2.4s have ....invacom lnbfs...

Yes, I noticed both of those errors, I asked them the qustion on their website, though for some reason they have not replied, nor displayed my question.

 

[guest poster]

That's even worse ... they should refund and compensate God knows how many who have bought that dish or the 1.8 and been given a very expensive LNB that reduces the dish size to about the size of one of the panels and then taken them back to Spain with them.

 

[dxsat]

Only the third picture shows the correct LNB and feedhorn in use, the others are completely wrong.
No real surprise given the number of cowboy 'installers' on the Costas. There's widespread disregard of good practice amongst these guys, who prey on the hapless Brits on the Spanish coasts. They will frequently claim that 'Portugese' dishes are the best for Spain and plant info on forums and the web justifying their crappy methods.

Many misguided people intent on DIY buy FortecStar 2.4m from Maplin, local papers or eBay and then wonder why they don't work.

The message on the Costas ought to be loud and clear: never buy a FortecStar dish, be highly sceptical about anything on the Maplin website, show the cowboys the door, insist on a decent quality installation (but be prepared to pay for it)

 

[guest poster]

We've seen people buying them in the UK and getting the wrong lnb(f) ready to take over to Spain... a colleague tried tell a guy about the build of the 2.4s and to at least get the right lnb/feedhorn...

....he thinks he still bought the wrong one.. a very over priced lnbf..

why?..

.... probably because most of the ones he'd seen around his place in Spain had the same dish with the wrong lnbf on them....

.... the sheep factor again... if everyone is doing it .....it must be right... right?

er..no....

 

[neoandy]

Hi all, i have been reading this post and im thinking twise before gettin maplins dish/lbn !!
I live about 20k north from ALC and i was thinkin on gettin this stuff for watching freesat, acording to whot i have read, it is gonna be a waste of money....can anybody explain please i if is a good idea to get all this and try to do it myself? As you have realized i wanna do it on my own, as a hobby but i do not want wife to smash my head by spending the money and then not bein able to get it right!
Please somebody help me !

What i wanted from Maplin :

_http://www.maplin.co.uk/module.aspx?moduleno=48743

_http://www.maplin.co.uk/module.aspx?moduleno=97081

Is this ok to be assambled and used near benidorm to get freesat ?

Many thanks in advance.

 

[neoandy]

Hi all I am new in all this wonderful world of satellites and I am about to get the same dish from the same online shop _www.maplin.co.uk..... and what is worse .... i live near Alicante too!!!!
Colud anybody advise which is the right lbn for this dish of 2.4 meters fortec Star, and if maplin has it ?
I has been really instructive reading all your posts and i know that i am in the right place to learn and be advised....

Many thanks in advance
Andy

 

[guest poster]

you could have an rtft fault...

 

[dxsat]

neoandy:
Short answer- don't!
This is the dish which has caused more queries to satellite help boards than any other. The queries usually start 'I have a petallised dish which is not bringing the channels I hoped' or "Why can't I get any BBC or ITV" .

The LNB Maplin say is for prime focus is nothing of the kind. It is an Invacom Single SNH-031.
It won't work properly as it is made for offset (oval shape) dishes.
Maplin used to sell this dish with a C120 LNB and prime focus feedhorn, but now none of the LNBs they sell is suitable.

Just avoid and buy something better. Bear in mind the most common dish in the Costa Blanca is the so- called 'Portugese' dish. These are made by Famaval in Portugal and are sold by Tecatel in Spain. They are really mediocre.

For best performance buy a professional -quality dish such as a Prodelin or ASC signal (formerly ChannelMaster/Andrew)

 

[Robbo]

Of course, if you buy a quality dish, and spend loads of euros on it, but can't get it to work, you would still be ableto get a pro' in to align and set it up for you. Whereas if you got the maplin cheapo, I imagine that it would be a waste.

 

[guest poster]

The 2.4m Andrews ASC is about £2500-3000 plus floor mount/pole... so you can see the attraction of the £170 2.4m or £100 1.8m.

If you go for a used one, the face on the ASC 2.4m is in two halves and even with the price 'they' are often put together wrong. If they are bolted up twisted, the shape is pulled out, in the hot Med sun, that could be permanent even if a professional comes along afterwards to sort it out.. it may not be possible and has thermally reset in the hot sun. The tolerance is 0.25 inch or .6mm (max out) on the 2.4m's seam. The bolting procedure and torque settings are critical too, and if that's not followed either that can spoil a dish too. Very few have the equipment to test the parabola's tolerance of dishes that size.

I think you could set up a 1.8 fs accurately and then strengthen it, with the right lnb/feed horn you'd match the C M.

not sure about doing the same with the 2.4 fortec star... turning it into a decent dish could cost too much.

 

[neoandy]

Many thanks for that!! nap could you tell me where in spain i can get this ChannelMaster/ Andrew.
And would not be an idea if i wanna try the dish....gettin a suttable LBN for it ??
In this case which would be the one? (model and brand ), i already know that u said the right one for this dished is c120 invacom, i just wanted to conform, and if it´s like that could you tell me where i can get it ?

Many thanks in advance great help on this ......

 

[neoandy]

Thanks Pedro2000uk Robo and snap, this is what i wanted, the professional and expirienced opinion, many many thanks, so eveybody against the petallised "Fortec Arghh" dish that Maplin has on offer?
There is no hope for it ?
Or with the right LNB could it be useful for the freesat channels ?
Remember that i am not a professional I want to do it as a hobby at home for the wife.
Snap i checked the web of Tecatel and they sale all the lbns mentioned in this forum, could it be an idea, gettin the LNB from Tecatel and the "Fortec Arghh"dish ??

Cheers
Andy.

 

[guest poster]

Many thanks for that!! nap could you tell me where in spain i can get this ChannelMaster/ Andrew.
And would not be an idea if i wanna try the dish....gettin a suttable LBN for it ??
In this case which would be the one? (model and brand ), i already know that u said the right one for this dished is c120 invacom, i just wanted to conform, and if it´s like that could you tell me where i can get it ?

Many thanks in advance great help on this ......

The ASC 2.4m & 1.8m's are offset dishes so you can use any good LNBf on them or a C120 (invacom C120 quad has a good reputation) with the matched feed horn for offset dishes... (not the feed horn for prime focus dishes!).

If you do use an LNBf you will need to make sure it can get close enough to the dish face for the focal point... either using a long necked lnbf or modify the holder... some LNBfs can do very well.

 

[dxsat]

Have to disagree strongly with you Pedro on the last point, a LNBF (one- piece LN will never perform anything like as well as a good C120 LNB, for Astra 2D reception (this is what drives the need for large dishes) a LNBF will disappoint. A 1.8m fortecstar dish will never come anything like a 1.8m ASC/Andrew dish for performance. It's not just build quality, a 1.8m prime focus will always have lower gain than a 1.8m offset dish, owing to the laws of physics.

Invacom C120 Quad has been proven many times to give the best BBC & ITV reception on dishes larger that 120 cm. I've done many tests myself, and posted the results on the forum.
I have a an interest in a BBC & Sky installation business in Madrid. My partner there will not use anything other than:
ASC/Andrew 180 dish, Invacom Quad C120 model QDF-031 and a ChannelMaster feedhorn.

There have been reports of people getting all BBC channels in the Alicante region on this dish.
I wouldn't recommend anyone getting a 240 cm ASC/Andrew or Prodelin owing to the cost.

ASC dishes are very easy to assemble and set up. They are so well- made they never distort in very high temperatures- in effect they are virtually indestructible. Prodelin dishes are very similar.

A number of places sell ASC/Andrew (Formerly channelMaster):
ASC/Andrew from Demon multimedia (you may have to wait)
_http://www.ciberland.com/
Prodelin from Tecatel (contact them to find a local dealer)
_http://www.tecatel.com/productoX.php?idp=816
Invacom LNB (currently in short supply) and Prodelin from Antnet Digital
_http://www.antnetdigital.com/en/
Feedhorn from:-
_http://www.satellitesuperstore.com/feedhorn.htm

Prodelin main page, e-mail to request more local dealers:
_http://www.tripointglobal.com/antennas.php

 

[neoandy]

Right guys, thanks again for all this info, that i need to use the technical dictionary to understand ( ) jejejeje.....
Anyway so if i go for the "Fortec Argh" and i get it correctly build up, getting an invacom c120, with the feedhorn that it comes (as both of you agreed that is the right one for a Prime Focus Dish) this should be then a matter of adjustement and presition.....
However, Snap said that the OffSet Dishes has betta results for the reception on BBC/ITV ( Freesat) channels in the Alicante Area.....could anybody tell me which is the most suitable dish (prime focus, off set ) type and size for the area i am (remember i am Near to benidorm in Alicante (latitude 38.5903° longitude -0.1311°)......
I understand this is not a easy goal to achieve but i am still stuborn and short of money enough to believe that this dish is complete rubish .....(mostly short of money jejejejeje).

Thanks and looking forward for your reply
Andy.