DISH ALIGNMENT PROBLEMS?

[Channel Hopper]

If you cannot replace the whole of the pipe then I would not bother.

The stability will not improve simply by adding a larger bit of steel at the top, and the movement of the shims inside the pipe will probably cause further trouble

I would suggest putting a number of steel guy lines from the back of the mount, as well as from a clamp placed as close to the base of the dish, and secure them well to the gound and close objects

What has Vincor said about your problems ?

 

[Old Satellite]

Hi Jack ,

From the latest information that you have copied it appears that the majority of the satellites that are giving you trouble are near towards the end of the arc, both from the west and from the east. Some of those satellites, have reasonable signal levels for your location and are simular to some that you recieve ok.

Do I understand correctly that each time for example if you have been on k5 or sbs 6 (East) etc then to go to G3 or Amc 4 etc then you have to adjust your threaded declination rod by hand ?

Is the case? or have i misunderstood ?


Old Satellite

 

[jackpeas]

HI CH, I am talking about putting 4" pipe by 15ft long over the 3" pipe and bolting to the 3"(remember ist 5' in the ground) And this is the best place for this. Are you saying dig another hole for the 4" ? To dig another hole westside of the old one ( I would be getting to close to Electric wires) On the eastside their trees. 4" pipe is much stronger than 3". No I have not talk to them (Vincor) Do you think the 3" is bending? Thank you Jackp n Chicago

 

[jackpeas]

HI OLD SAT, I tried everything to get GO-ch9 (my download ch to come in) Remember we had the declination rod out 31 turn from the ring (top 2 rod only) So I put 2 nuts their,to mark the spot where the 31 turn end. So I can get it back there. Then I move the cross member in to 2 1/4 from the ring, that where it is now. The bottom bolts are 2" from the ring. That where it was before I found you guys.But GO ch24 (outdoor CH) is not come in very good,I am getting good reading but my digital wont come in.Those bolts in the declination rod (top2 3/4x8"long to the ring and from the inside of the ring out 3/4x 11" and the bottom2 are 3/4x 6" long 3/4x 8 3/4" out. When I couldn't get GO, I move the feed, I move the elevation rod too.I went back to AMC3 K3 @87 tiring to get it to come in better.Yes it seem to me the sat are coming in good on the eastside but the k5@79, sbs6, 74deg, w6-k6@72 It could be the trees, I don't go any further east because of the limit. So from AMC3 to F1-A2@ 107 everything is good.But going west M5, A1-E1.GO-ox,G5,G9,T7-L7,C3,G1, I get something but it not clear. 2 sat come in ,AMC C4, andAMC7 Ch 7 fox come in, west end sat.I have trees but idon't think they are blocking GO. Maybe the other. Thank you jackp n Chicago Hey I had that Ideal about useing my 18" actuator arm for elevation,but I don't have a controler(all I have is a positioner)

 

[Old Satellite]

[updated:LAST EDITED ON 26-Jun-02 AT 11:25 AM (GMT)]Hi Jack Peas,

Normally the 3 " pole without a lot of cross bracing is to small for a 3.0 mtr (solid) dish the potential wind loading is just to high. Yes has Channel Hopper highlighted the pole may be moving either in the wind or has the weight of the dish moves on the mount ?

you can check the later with a sprit level at several locations when the dish is moved between satellites.

Normally the 3" is ok up to a 1.8 (Solid)or maybe a 2.0mtr (solid) many mesh dish installations have utilsied 3" on a 3.0 mtr mesh dish, but potentially at much lower heights, and not without problems.

Are the signals that are the weakest generally the KU or C band ?

or is it a mix of ku and c channels ?

The 4" will help but for a 3 mtr solid you need a 5" or greater pole

From what you say about moving the elevation and declination bolts there is still some way to go.

First could you check:- when you rotate the dish to 87.0 GE3 does the dish appear to point exactly at the same point as the polar mount, or is the dish facing towards the west or east if so by how many degrees can you estimate it is pointing from GE3 ?

Adjust the elevation for the best signal, with the declination angle set also. Then without adjusting either the elevation or declination
see if you can recieve GE1 and Ge5 or sbs 6 if so what are the signal strengths for them on c and ku?

It is also possible that the feed horn is not perpendiclar (Approx 11:00 a clock normally) to the axis of rotation resulting in cross transponder muiltiplexing of the digitals channel. If the signal is strong but the quality of signal is low then this is normaly the problem.

You can try by rotating the feed horn has you have previously very slowly while some one else is watching to see if the quality increases?

Old Satellite

 

[jackpeas]

HI OLD SAT,No I don't move the declination rod everytime (just for GO) I think my elevation is off, my declination is off, my feed is off. I don't know to start. How do I know when the declinaion is right? And how do I measure it? What am I looking for? I don't understand this. On the declination rod I think we had it at 6.4(31 turn) Then I move it back to 2 1/4 from the ring.

 

[Old Satellite]

[updated:LAST EDITED ON 27-Jun-02 AT 07:42 AM (GMT)]Hi Jack,

First set the elevation, then the Declination and then the feedhorn.

According to the DH manual your Elevation should be 41.7 degrees and your decliantion should be approx 5.67 degrees.

(The declination is set on the bolts that hold the dish to the mount. the elevation is on the mount by the turnbuckle at the lower of the mount.)

Only set them when they are on G3 87 South at your location. If you use a good high quality angle level you should be able to set it intially within 0.2-0.5 degrees - if I remember my own cam from Sears and cost about $25 when I lived in the USA.

once you have set them then try the process below



When the dish is at 87.0 GE3 does the dish appear to point exactly at the same point as the polar mount, or is the dish facing towards the west or east if so by how many degrees can you estimate it is pointing from GE3 ?

Are the signals that are the weakest generally the KU or C band ?

Adjust the elevation for the best signal, with the declination angle -generally intially set the declination and dont move it again

hen without adjusting either the elevation or declination
see if you can recieve GE1 and Ge5 or sbs 6 if so what are the signal strengths for them on c and ku?

As long as the feed horn is either approx 11:00 or set the corotor at 45 degree from vertical when it is at its highest point (south facing)

We can work on the feedhorn later.

I suggest we work on the mount first.

let me know what happens when you have finished the above

Old Satellite

 

[jackpeas]

HI OLD SAT,I will do what you say,I will go to amc3(k3)ch600 and set the elevation at41.7. I can do that.ok Now on the declination,where do I read the degree for the declination(face of the dish,I don't have anything that long,I could put 2 (2x4 ) together to make it work.) Now the reading the declination( when I start to turn the 2 studs bolts out(taking the reading from the ring or the face?)When I am useing the angle finder, do I add 41.5 to5.67 for my final reading of46.72 Ok I will try today.I am tring to make sure I understand. I got the Ideal what we are tying to do(tring to move the dish up to the sat (elev) down or foward to the sat(dec) I know I am not making any sence. That why I am asking how will I know? By the angle finder reading. This will let me know I am going in the right direction. Seem like I am losing it. Thank you guys jackp n Chicago

 

[Old Satellite]

Hi Jack,


Do you still have the DH manual ? if not try and download from thier website.

It provides a picture veiw of how to set the elevation and declination

Yes, you do need to add them togeather the 41.7 + 5.67 it very important to set the declination correctly, if it is set wrong instead of following the ge-stationary arc it could just look into space.
Yes you need to change the two threaded bolts so that they respectively are equal and offset the angle by approx 5.7 degrees. nromally you can get a good indication of the correct angle from the rear of dish mount.

Good Look

Old Satellite

 

[jackpeas]

HI OLD SAT, I have not move anything yet,but Iam getting k5@79 deg Its coming in .Its has sparkle,the digital k5 ch 600 is coming good but when the wind blow I lose it. This could be ,the pole,or not align right. Thank you jackp N Chicago

 

[jackpeas]

HI OLD SAT,The reason I have not posted in a few days is, my feedhorns I am having problems with odds and even channels (no its not the servo motor) How do I know? Because I put on a non servo motor feed on and I am still having the same problem. What I do is cut a 1 1/2 pvc pipe 36" long for a guide(put this on the center hole in the dish and thur the scalar ring. Then I slide the feed in on top of the pipe. the pipe act as a stop,its also help to center the feed)But lately I have been havng a hard time. Standing on a 8 ft ladder on top of a camper is not best place to be tring to do this. I am getting upset(fustrighted I dont know how to spell it anyway) at myself.I have never had a problem put on a feed before. I just put on at 11 oclock and it work. I must be losing it. I think I will find someone to do this before I go nutts.Remember I said in july if I dont get this dish go I will change to the wineguard,2 more week than that its down she come. All the cable you see at the feed, Is for 2c&2ku lnb feed,and dbs feed. I spend more time change thing. ok enough. Thank you jackp n Chicago

 

[Old Satellite]

Hi Jack,

From what you say I think there may be a problem with the pole, if when the wind came you lost, or the signal got weaker then the pole or something is moving.

The Winegaurd possibly never had this problem as upto around the 40-50 Mph wind gust point the mesh dish places less strain on your mount and pole etc.

As I said the DH dish is normally one of the best that you can buy, Setting the Feed to the dish is normally best accomplished with a accurate tape or a single metal rod measured at lease at three locations. Your plastic pipe may not be accurate anougth ?

Normally if you are only 1/8 " out of adjustment from the correct focal point you will loose 3 DB that the differance from a good 10 ft to a 12 ft dish.

Normally setting the feed horn at 11:00am is ok providing your dish is at the highest point of the arc when it is set.

I know the time its taken is long but the extra gain of the DH is worth it.

However form what you say about the wind- I think you will have to change the pipe to 5" or add additional bracing to stop the movement if you want to keep the DH dish in Operation.

Old Satellite

 

[jackpeas]

HI OLD SAT,My wineguard dish is still good condition,It was align be fore I took it down.My wineguard is sweet dish I had no problem with it. I am at the point where I am saying to hell with DH satellite dish.All I wanted was to get a better picture, I dont know if that what I am getting.To installed a 5''x18'ft (4ft in the ground) pipe and buing the 5'' dish cap, taking it down, Is lot of work. We are not sure that it would work. I am sure we will be go back to the wineguard dish. This will be less problems. Now back to this feedhorn problem.I have me 2c&2ku feed on the system.But I am only getting odds on one sat and even on the other(like bad servo motor) but on this feed their is no servo motor. I was thinking that it don't make and difference where the c-band lnb go. I have misplace my tracker10 book which has this info. My hidden signals sat-book I can't find this info. That why I change the feed out to make sure it not the servo motor, now i know it the placement of the feed, so far in from the dish and turn the right way. I am up 12'ft in the air on a ladder reachering about 3' or4' ft to do this on top of a camper. Go back to the basic on installing the feed (I will mark it on the scala ring) where it go. I have a lot of scala rings. Iam not using the one with DBS lnb on it .You ask me about the Manual-book from DH SAtellite, I would not called that a manual what I got( look like some one made a copy) I will get warren to make a copy from their site. I had no problem installing my wineguard. Might of fact the f/d is 41''. My buddy Ozzie made me a tool for installing the feed on this one Ok. thank you jackp n chicago

 

[Old Satellite]

Hi Jack,

With the problems that you have it might be an easier option to change back to the old Winegaurd, but it is a lot of money spent to not use the DH.

The 5 "pole i believe or substantial bracing is i believe essential for the DH the extra wind loading is just to much for a 3" pole.

The LNB on the dual feed or normally offset by 90 degree,this again is reletive to the highest point of the arc(87degree.
If you see as you say some opposite polaritys from the two c band lnbs then it would suggest that that they are closer to 45 degree thus allowing partly reception from either lnb of either horizontal or vertical transponders.
If I remember the set up information for the ADI twin ku and twin c is not so good, always remmember that as you rotate through the arc that they will be a weakening of signal ( due to cross channel interferance this will be more notacible at the end of the arc.

Try to make sure that they are approx 90 degree apart and then fine adjust the feed with repsect to the highest point of the recievable satellite arc.

Do you have the same problem on the KU band or not ?


Old Satellite

 

[jackpeas]

HI OLD SAT, Yes my ku have the same problem. I dont know what to do. To change back to my ADL 1c& 1ku feed, I need to get the feed straighten out. Mean while I will be thinking on the 5'' pipe by 20'ft 5ft in the ground,15 ft in the air to clear the roof with the HH mount(I wiil give you the roof height, and you can tell me how much more I need to clear) HH drop down when its going west so It would not hit my roof(I dont know how much drop down their is.)I will have to dig another hole,I will have buy the HH mount,end cap. I will drive up there and pick it up. Did I tell you that drove up to skyvision, Fergus,MN.That about 700 or 800 mile from me.I wanted to buy a dish and I did like what they had. I think it was a UNImesh dish with the spincanation Now it time to think about how much this will cost. I think you said the HH mount cost over $300 buck( I hear that this mount is not as good as the old one<(quality wise) weak. I would like to get one just about as good as the old(AJACK 180 HH mount) that a mount.Wont the 5'' cap add weight? If you tell me this is going to work I will do it( I am talking about making it easy to align the dish) and to installed.I will have to go online and fine out the cost.Tell me how deep I need to dig the hole, how much pole to put in the ground? How big of hole? How much Cement(bags)? I know I will have to weld something to the bottom to keep it from turnning ok.Now let work on getting the feed on right.So only change the feed on amc-k3@87 deg.What else I need to know? ok Thank you jackp n Chicago

 

[Channel Hopper]

I dont know if I am reasing your last post correctly, but if you are thinking of buying a Unimesh ---- dont

It will not give decent response at Ku band in standard form

Unimesh no longer exist as a company

Stick with the solid dishes for now

 

[jackpeas]

HI OLD SAT, you are reading it wrong(this is before i got the DH Satellite)
Thank you jackp n Chicago

 

[jackpeas]

HI OLD SAT,My roof is 8'8'' of the ground on the side where i am puting the 5''pole, so I need to know how much pipe I need and how deep? I will try to find a 20ft pipe x5'' somewhere. I guest I will have to live with just getting one tp at a time.If I am going to get a HH mount I want a good one not a cheappie, One with good motor and strong. Give some prices on HH mount. I will try on my end find some input. I think maybe I can put the pole on the west side of the old pole. That why I need know how big of cement base I need. Thank you jackp n chicago

 

[Channel Hopper]

Rule of thumb is 30% of the post should be under the ground so if you need 8' in the air (I take it this is to the base of the polarmount and not the lowest part of the dish) then you are looking at 4' under

If you can go to Prodelins website and look under the manual section for the 3.8m antenna, the first thre pages of the manual mention the recommended concrete structure for building a stable platform on one of their antenna when sourcing a post from an ironmonger (do they use that term in the US ?)

 

[jackpeas]

HI OLD SAT, You can only get 21'ft pole here.15 ft in the air, 6'ft in the ground. that it. I will visted the prodelin website. Remember I had a radio shack dish with HH mount that frist dish I got 8.5ft. I forgot how high it was in the air. But It did drop down a lot almost hitting the roof.6'ft in the ground is about all I can get. No we dont use such term. ok Thank you jackp n Chicago