Eutelsat 28A switchoff looming

[egghead]

hi...

firstly an apology... this thread is probably the wrong place to ask this - sorry!

first question is: are people sure that the eutelsat channels have moved to the astra 2f uk spotbeam? the reason i ask is that i still seem to be able to receive some of the migrated channels (cbs drama, chart show and various 'true' channels) albeit now in a glitchy blocky manner here just north of berlin on a 100cm dish... this would be a first for me (haven't had a sniff of the uk spotbeams since the migration from astra 1n).

i guess that the signal is currently boosted and will weaken as the migration progresses and i'll no longer be able to get anything after a week or two.

second question is: if i can get these signals blockily on a 100cm dish, would i be able to get relatively stable reception of astra 2f's main uk spot with a slightly larger (say 120-150cm)?

sorry again!

 

[Fisty McB]

The former E28A transmissions that have just jumped to 2F have at present a more rugged FEC of 2/3 compared to the normally 5/6 FEC of the rest of the UK spot beam transmissions on 2E & 2F. That likely explains why you're able to get a sniff of a signal there.

As for the second part of your question, someone will likely know better than me. I'd make an assumption that a larger dish would get you a better "chance", but you might only be able to get reception when rain or snow isn't falling.

 

[4wd]

are people sure that the eutelsat channels have moved to the astra 2f uk spotbeam? the reason i ask is that i still seem to be able to receive some of the migrated channels

if i can get these signals blockily on a 100cm dish, would i be able to get relatively stable reception of astra 2f's main uk spot with a slightly larger (say 120-150cm)?

The former E28A transmissions that have just jumped to 2F have at present a more rugged FEC of 2/3 compared to the normally 5/6 FEC of the rest of the UK spot beam transmissions on 2E & 2F. That likely explains why you're able to get a sniff of a signal there.

That's the situation here too, periods where ch5 etc are well below reception, can still get a picture from the newly moved channels (the 'trues' etc) on the same sat\beam, even when they are at incredibly low levels. The so-called FEC they use is seamingly the reason.

If you see signs of pictures off 2F spot there is hope, look for reports from others in the region. Here am awaiting that it all stabilises (2G full operative + e28a gone) before evaluating dish size.

 

[Fisty McB]

Rough capacity calculation - current DVB-S transmissions with SR 27500 & FEC 2/3 gives a net data rate of 33.79 Mbit/s.

Retaining the same symbol rate but changing the FEC gives the following capacity...

3/4 - 38.02 Mbit/s
5/6 - 42.24 Mbit/s
7/8 - 44.35 Mbit/s

So changing the FEC to 5/6 will give roughly 8.5 Mbit/s more data, surely more tempting to change to considering signal levels now in the core reception area.

Also the current 11224 V transmission (transponder C2L) is DVB-S despite only carrying HD channels and could surely convert over to DVB-S2 in due course as well once it gets bounced on to the Astra fleet. I'll just go through some common/popular values...

DVB-S2, SR 29500 (higher symbol rate available, same as used by Sky for 36 MHz transponders between 11.7 - 12.5 GHz)...

QPSK 2/3 - 39.01 Mbit/s
QPSK 3/4 - 43.88 Mbit/s (used by Sky on some transponders)
QPSK 5/6 - 48.81 Mbit/s
QPSK 9/10 - 52.76 Mbit/s

8PSK 2/3 - 58.43 Mbit/s (used by Sky & BBC on FSS band transponders with a SR 23000)
8PSK 3/4 - 65.73 Mbit/s (used by ITV on 11053 H with SR 23000)
8PSK 5/6 - 73.18 Mbit/s (tested earlier this year by SES & ITV)

So if they changed the 11224 V transponder in the future to DVB-S2 8PSK SR 29500 FEC 3/4, they could nearly double their data rate capacity.

 

[M60]

Lyngsat are calling the new 2F transponders TA5 to TA8. Can anyone think what TA stands for?

Tilted Angle!

 

[archive10]

Interestingly, none the of the TPs discussed so far has bothered my reception.
But I was zapping though to check general reception, and suddenly I have pixellation on Movies 4 men and <same> + 1 on 12633H (clear skies).

This would be not unusual for 28A, but strange for 2E/F. Especially 2F (where lyngsat says it is coming from), which otherwise gives me stonking performance on HD channels in the lower regions of the frequency band.

Everything else seems to come through without problems...

??

Have to do a follow-up check during the week-end; need to attend to business tomorrow

(this is on the CM180/Inverto BUQuattro, originally aimed at 2D at 28.2E)

 

[cazhh]

Interestingly, none the of the TPs discussed so far has bothered my reception.
But I was zapping though to check general reception, and suddenly I have pixellation on Movies 4 men and <same> + 1 on 12633H (clear skies).

At least it has around 18db here. So it is on the PE Beam. The SNR goes up and down +-0.4db which points to 2F. 2E doesn't have this miniwobbling.
Picture looks fine as well. Perhaps it was a temporary problem with the upstream.

 

[hvdh]

Looking at the timing, chances are it was AMC-14 (inclined military sat) crossing the belt at 29.5°E, 20 minutes ago (00:12 CEST).
It has some active transponders between 12.2 and 12.7 GHz.

 

[uwsc_de]

Hi. I am reading the forums for some time now and signed up today. Just for the recurring questions about SNR levels and FEC. There are two sites I found:

http://www.satbroadcasts.com/news,7...se_ratio_values_CNR,_CN_for_DVB_S_system.html
http://www.satbroadcasts.com/news,8...e_ratio_values_CNR,_CN_for_DVB_S2_system.html

Regards,
Uwe

 

[Pietclock]

Here is how the new situation looks like here:


The signal levels of the new 2F - E28A -legacy transponders are quite low.

 

[cazhh]

something happened to 11934 V. It might be related to the switches:



It dropped a few db and is extremely wobbly now.

 

[timo_w2s]

something happened to 11934 V. It might be related to the switches:



It dropped a few db and is extremely wobbly now.

Sky have been playing with the FEC on a few transponders. Would your system be able to update the FEC automatically? Not sure if this one has changed today or not though.

 

[cazhh]

dreambox. let me check. The one doing the measurements is in the basement

[...]

FEC switched from 2/3 to 5/6. The box did not update automatically.

Thanks for the hint.

 

[Tururu]

I note your references William-1 and left the mine to see how they are going to affect the changes.
We are in a good position, further south if they noticed changes mark the first change.
--------------------
Tomo nota de tus referencias William-1 y dejo las mias para ver como nos van afectando los cambios.
Estamos en buena posicion, mas al sur si notaron cambios de huella con el primer cambio.

Astra 2F UK beam after the transfer June 1st 2015
11307 H 27500 2/3 = 8.50dB SNR53% AGC99% BER 0
11307 V 27500 2/3 = 8.50dB SNR53% AGC99% BER 0
11343 V 27500 2/3 = 9.00dB SNR56% AGC99% BER 0
11344 H 27500 2/3 = 8.50dB SNR53% AGC99% BER 0
Next transfer
Current E28A beam - Quality readings
11222 H 27500 2/3 = 10.00dB SNR62% AGC99% BER 0
11261 H 27500 2/3 = 9.50dB SNR53% AGC99% BER 0
Next transfer
Current E28A beam - Quality readings
11389 H 27500 2/3 = 9.00dB SNR56% AGC99% BER 0
11390 V 27500 2/3 = 8.50dB SNR53% AGC99% BER 0
11426 V 27500 2/3 = 10.50dB SNR65% AGC99% BER 0
11428 H 27500 2/3 = 7.50dB SNR50% AGC99% BER 0
--------------------------
11585 H 22000 5/6 D7S 17.00dB SNR100% AGC99% BER 0
11604 V 29500 3/4 D8S 17.00dB SNR100% AGC99% BER 0
11662 H 27500 2/3 D11S(D9S) 12.50dB SNR 81% AGC99% BER 0
11681 V 27500 2/3 D12S 16.50dB SNR100% AGC99% BER 0

 

[Pietclock]

here is an overview of all TPs 11.7-12.68 GHz on 28E. This was done at 16:00 CET with 125cm - not big enough to decode that very weak 12.422 spot (BBC RB channels).

 

[william-1]

Found this thread from a year ago here.
If accurate, then SES certainly seemed to be playing a game of confidence. I wonder if they have Astra 2e, 2f & 2g set up on 11.2 - 11.45GHz for both their standard band plan plus that of Eutelsat, the former in case one of these birds is required elsewhere?

https://www.satellites.co.uk/forums/threads/astra-2e-2f-2g-frequency-plan-28-2-28-5-east.161813/

Yes, these frequency plans of Astra 2E, 2f and 2G are forecasts only, made by our member Marcus_21, and were posted in this forum.

 

[hvdh]

Pietclock this forum is not DF ;) please simply use the "Upload a file" button, clicking your scans only show Directupload spam screens.

 

[Pietclock]

I tried that, didnt work ! "There was a problem uploading your file".

Btw, it is quite interesting that we havent seen any Europe beam activity of both 2F and 2E below 11.7GHz so far. None.... the two data transponders are on 2C, the other 4 strong TPs in Band B are still on E28A...

 

[PaulR]

I tried that, didnt work ! "There was a problem uploading your file".

Could be a couple of things. First, is the file too large? Not sure of the exact limits but anything under a MB should be OK. Second, what type of file is it? If it's not one of the allowed types then it can't be uploaded directly. The answer for this is to wrap it inside a ZIP file .

 

[Tururu]

While Madrid 12.422H27500 channels (BBC channels R DB800S-HD tuner (94cm dish).
12.422H27500.- 5'50dB, signal / SNR 34%.
------------
Por Madrid bien los canales 12.422H27500 (BBC RB channels), sintonizador DB800S-HD (94cm plato).
12.422H27500.- 5'50dB, señal/SNR 34%.