News from a 28e revenant :O)

Nalleman

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transponder used by High View,which one is that?
12610 V DVB-S2 8PSK,SR 22000 and FEC 3/4 on Astra 1Lfor their transmissions in SD and 12640 V DVB-S2 8PSK, SR 23500 and FEC 3/4 on Astra 1N for their transmissions in HD (encrypted).
 

Nalleman

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I should add 12670 V (same parameters as on 12640 V) is also used for some channels in HD (encrypted).
Channels on both 12640 and 12670 are part of HD+ which offers lots of channels in HD and three channels in UHD. All encrypted.
 

4wd

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Signal has increased since 2 or 3 days ago, good news!
To be honest, this year I only had a few break ups last week and the beginning of this one.

"4wd" check today
Yep, these days got every and all channels, HD & SD,, around 3 dB +, just what's needed for 24\24 with a small rain margin.
So hope is back and (sat)spirit is lifting.
 

superpascu2

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Yep, these days got every and all channels, HD & SD,, around 3 dB +, just what's needed for 24\24 with a small rain margin.
So hope is back and (sat)spirit is lifting.
Forget about the margin for the rain. With 8PSK there is no margin for rain!!! It drops heavily. But enjoy the it while it last...
 

Pride Of Cucamonga

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A simple look at the transponders in use at 19 East would suggest that German broadcasters have absolutely no issues using 8PSK modulation via satellite for HD (and some SD) broadcasts.

It is simply a case that whoever is in charge of transmission capacity will evaluate the best method of delivering a balance of data capacity for channels verses the size of satellite dish required for reception from a given satellite.
To give a recent example, the transponder used by High View for their channels that were launched on 19 East earlier this year use 8PSK with an FEC of 3/4 for the single transponder they are carried. They're presuming that this will be adequate in terms of reception for the average German satellite TV viewer using (for example) a 60cm fixed satellite dish pointed at 19 East.

yep, makes sense to use 8PSK 3/4 FEC in Germany where signal stronger. Movistar for Spain however uses 8PSK 2/3

Is QPSK 9/10 (e.g 11778V) stronger or weaker than 8PSK 3/4?
 

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6,5 dB - 7,9 dB
 

rodscha

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On astra 1L(19E) I seem to have trouble receiving this TP,more often it s "sound & no picture". Picture may come (or not)after repeated tweaking only.Any idea as to why? Kingofsat has:

12610.50
V112Astra 1LDVB-S28PSK22000 3/4
 

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On astra 1L(19E) I seem to have trouble receiving this TP,
The 19e sidemounted lnb on the 28e UK dish, no problem. BTW, flysat lists it on A 1N.

28e, 2 transponders went dead here, 11038 V (Quest, Dmax) & 12382 H (Quest, Dmax). Any known changes ?
 

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4wd

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28e, 2 transponders went dead here, 11038 V (Quest, Dmax) & 12382 H (Quest, Dmax). Any known changes ?
Fixed with TS Satelites Editor
 

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Fisty McB

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To try and clear things up...

For a given power level & FEC, a DVB-S2 transponder broadcasting with 8PSK modulation will require a higher signal to noise (SNR) ratio to successfully decode transmissions than if it was QPSK modulation (either DVB-S or DVB-S2).

This simply means the receiver requires a stronger SNR, not that the transmitted signal power is inherently weaker!

Prior to the adoption of DVB-S2, when it was DVB-S only, only the FEC could be changed to allow whoever was transmitting on a transponder to increase the bitrate (all other things being equal e.g. Symbol rate). With the introduction of DVB-S2, three additional modulation modes were added - 8PSK, 16APSK & 32APSK though only 8PSK is used for regular broadcasts to home users, each modulation value having pros & cons as to their usability for transmission.

In the case of the transponders that at 28 degrees east been converting to DVB-S2 since the start of the year, they mostly (but not all) converted from DVB-S FEC-5/6 to DVB-S2 8PSK FEC-2/3. The SNR required for the former is 6.5db while the latter is 6.6db - essentially no real difference as far as reception goes.

DVB-S2 8PSK transmissions are used on geostationary satellites across the Clarke Belt, serving across the world, for over 15 years now. It's a very mature & well tested mode of transmission.
 

Pride Of Cucamonga

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To try and clear things up...

For a given power level & FEC, a DVB-S2 transponder broadcasting with 8PSK modulation will require a higher signal to noise (SNR) ratio to successfully decode transmissions than if it was QPSK modulation (either DVB-S or DVB-S2).

This simply means the receiver requires a stronger SNR, not that the transmitted signal power is inherently weaker!

Prior to the adoption of DVB-S2, when it was DVB-S only, only the FEC could be changed to allow whoever was transmitting on a transponder to increase the bitrate (all other things being equal e.g. Symbol rate). With the introduction of DVB-S2, three additional modulation modes were added - 8PSK, 16APSK & 32APSK though only 8PSK is used for regular broadcasts to home users, each modulation value having pros & cons as to their usability for transmission.

In the case of the transponders that at 28 degrees east been converting to DVB-S2 since the start of the year, they mostly (but not all) converted from DVB-S FEC-5/6 to DVB-S2 8PSK FEC-2/3. The SNR required for the former is 6.5db while the latter is 6.6db - essentially no real difference as far as reception goes.

DVB-S2 8PSK transmissions are used on geostationary satellites across the Clarke Belt, serving across the world, for over 15 years now. It's a very mature & well tested mode of transmission.
good info, thanks. would DVB-S2 QPSK have lower signal strength than DVB-S at the same FEC?

Why aren't all DVB-S2 transponders at 28.2E 8PSK?
 

rodscha

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In the case of the transponders that at 28 degrees east been converting to DVB-S2 since the start of the year, they mostly (but not all) converted from DVB-S FEC-5/6 to DVB-S2 8PSK FEC-2/3. The SNR required for the former is 6.5db while the latter is 6.6db - essentially no real difference as far as reception goes.

Except that the received signal changes from 76%to 30%.... so,no change in reception????
I know 30% now means nothing when rain comes ,or when low propagation sets in.
Before it worked almost all the time....no big change?
 

Nalleman

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good info, thanks. would DVB-S2 QPSK have lower signal strength than DVB-S at the same FEC?

Why aren't all DVB-S2 transponders at 28.2E 8PSK?
Look in the table I posted. There you can see the difference in C/N needed to get a picture depending on which technique used.
The strength of the transmitted signal is the same but the signal needed for the receiver to produce a picture is higher when using 8PSK.
 

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4wd

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In the case of the transponders that at 28 degrees east been converting to DVB-S2 since the start of the year, they mostly (but not all) converted from DVB-S FEC-5/6 to DVB-S2 8PSK FEC-2/3. The SNR required for the former is 6.5db while the latter is 6.6db - essentially no real difference as far as reception goes.

Except that the received signal changes from 76%to 30%.... so,no change in reception????
I know 30% now means nothing when rain comes ,or when low propagation sets in.
Before it worked almost all the time....no big change?
Ain't it just the same that I get here (dept. 06, not that far from Mediterranean & Italy border)? A general diminished level for anything from 28e spot beams (SD, HD, whatever FEC) > change of beam area coverage > less signal to grab for us fringies vs a few years ago. No changes to the Europe beam, looks strong enough to melt the LNB as before.
 

rodscha

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Ain't it just the same that I get here (dept. 06, not that far from Mediterranean & Italy border)? A general diminished level for anything from 28e spot beams (SD, HD, whatever FEC) > change of beam area coverage > less signal to grab for us fringies vs a few years ago. No changes to the Europe beam, looks strong enough to melt the LNB as before.
yes,but it seems they re shifting lots of stuff on the weaker.8psk Let s hope Labour stops this movement!!
 

Nalleman

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yes,but it seems they re shifting lots of stuff on the weaker.8psk Let s hope Labour stops this movement!!
Labour won't stop the change to a new technique even if it's makes it harder for those outside the intended coverage area to watch the programs intended for the UK.
 
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