Setting up a Moteck H180 GTP-1800AM 36V HH motor.

[Llew]

Hi Llew,

so you actually drilled the black mounting holes larger so that the original bottom bracket plate would fit better, I just had a look at your picture on page 2 with the mounting holes on the bottom side slightly larger.

To be honest i think i will just do aceb's trick and switch the mounting plates from top to bottom saves any more drilling and me messing it up, my dish is the same as yours so i just took the AZ/EL mount completely off and bolted the plate straight onto the back of the dish using the supplied bolts which are just the right fit.

I just drilled two holes a little back from the original ones. I did this before attaching the motor to the dish, so I don't know if I I'd had tried to use the original holes if clearance between the dish and plate would have been compromised.

The mentioned holes in the pic possibly a perspective illusion.

 

[aceb]

Digi, did you source that 76mm pole locally or from a national supplier and how much was it and where did the brackets come from? I need to replace my scaf pole and TKs with something more substantial but we don't have any metal suppliers locally so it's difficult to get prices, online stockists either don't give prices or their sites are a minefield of different gauges.

 

[Mickha]

Hi digi 247,
I have altered aceb's photo to show you where I had to drill the holes.
In aceb's photo he has switched the bottom bracket, with the top, so although the arrows are drawn on the top bracket, on my motor, and those shipped, this bracket is at the bottom, tha same as you currently have it set up.


The blue arrows are where the original holes are, the red are where I drilled new holes, in the silver bracket, about half way between the original and the front of the bracket. This solved all my problems as I could then fit the original, stronger, bolts, and the adapter plate fitted as it should.
This motor seems to be for the American market and so the extension brackets, as used in America, would go on the bottom, and not the top, which means they would have no problem in the USA. In the UK the extenders need to be at the top, which is why I needed to drill the 2 holes.
I hope this makes it clearer.

 

[digi247]

Digi, did you source that 76mm pole locally or from a national supplier and how much was it and where did the brackets come from? I need to replace my scaf pole and TKs with something more substantial but we don't have any metal suppliers locally so it's difficult to get prices, online stockists either don't give prices or their sites are a minefield of different gauges.

Hi aceb,

I sourced mine from Eurosat which is where i get most of my gear from for my jobs, not too sure if they supply to the public or if its trade only never really asked anyway the Pole and Brackets came to around just over £110 all in

Regards.

 

[digi247]

Hi digi 247,
I have altered aceb's photo to show you where I had to drill the holes.
In aceb's photo he has switched the bottom bracket, with the top, so although the arrows are drawn on the top bracket, on my motor, and those shipped, this bracket is at the bottom, tha same as you currently have it set up.
View attachment 49496

The blue arrows are where the original holes are, the red are where I drilled new holes, in the silver bracket, about half way between the original and the front of the bracket. This solved all my problems as I could then fit the original, stronger, bolts, and the adapter plate fitted as it should.
This motor seems to be for the American market and so the extension brackets, as used in America, would go on the bottom, and not the top, which means they would have no problem in the USA. In the UK the extenders need to be at the top, which is why I needed to drill the 2 holes.
I hope this makes it clearer.

Hi Mickha,

Tanks for the clearer explanation and the edited photo i know what you mean now, I have currently swapped the brackets around for now and once the weather clears a little and i get all my cabling re-done i am going to try it with the bracket setup same as aceb which saves me another drilling job LOL.

Thanks again.

 

[aceb]

As a footnote to the different versions of Gibertini I don't think I made it totally clear in my original post but if the motor is being installed on the version I have it will need spacers between the elevation metalwork and the adapter plate otherwise the main dish bracket touches the plate and cannot be adjusted. Photo four shows the rectangular extrusion I used between bracket and plate.

 

[digi247]

@ aceb ,Llew & Mickha.


Just a quick one really, this is doing my head in managed to get a new motor all drilled and attached as it should be and aligned spot on with the plate, here is the problem i can track from 57° east to around 18° west no problem and all readings are as they should be my problem is that after 18° west especially 30° west i lose around 8db signal i have scratched around my shabby brain and altered that many times i have forgot for the life of me i know its out somewhere but where is what is bugging me.

If i alter the declination adjuster to get a good signal on 30° west i lose everything past 7° west all the way through the east.

i would just like a fresh pair of eyes just to go over something that i may have missed.

Thanks Guys.

 

[Llew]

Hi digi, make sure your azimuth is spot on - I had the same problem, losing signal either side of the arc depending on whether the motor's pole clamp (or in my case the pole itself) was a few millimetres out either side of the correct azimuth. It was enough to throw my alignment out.

 

[radtv]

Yes, mine's almost the same, excepting for the Hirschmann logo on the dish, and the Az/El part came separate with the polar mount.

These are Gibertini, Hirschmann had them branded by Gibby for them then when Triax bought Hirschmann they returned them to Gibby!

 

[Huevos]

If i alter the declination adjuster to get a good signal on 30° west i lose everything past 7° west all the way through the east.

Assuming the pole is plumb...

To get a good signal on 30ºW do you have to pull the dish up or let it down? If you have to raise it your motor is slightly east of due south and if you have to lower the elevation of the dish the motor is too far west. Chances are it is 1mm or less that you need to move it.

 

[Mickha]

Hi digi247 can you upload a picture?
Are you using the Moteck option, for fine tuning, or like aceb the gibertini option?

 

[aceb]

Hope I'm not teaching anyone to suck eggs here.

A tip for getting the main pole absolutely plumb on a scaffold pole (although not quite so convenient on a 76mm but still the same theory) is to get hold of an end cap from a scaffolding company or buiiding site. All the ones I've had have got an injection moulding point right in the middle of the cap, drill it out with the smallest bit you have and fix a plumb bob in it that is long enough to poke out the bottom of the pole, I use fishing line and a small weight. Once the motor is on the pole check the line is dead centre in both axis where it exits the bottom of the pole. I used 2lb club hammer to fine tune mine lol

When I checked my main azimuth I set it to due south and made a note of the positioner value. Once I'd got it close enough to get signals I noted the values of 45E and 45W and did the sums to see if it was the same value from the due south reading. It quickly got me very close to being spot on but it still needed fine tuning going back and forwards across the arc, the final tweaks to the elevation and inclination were in the order of 1/4 turn on the nuts and azimuth was more gentle pressure with the nuts slackened as little as possible rather than any visible movement of the motor round the pole.

Edited to add; Yours seems as awkward to work on as mine which is why I did all the hard work at ground level on the patio mount before putting it up on the main pole and adjusting the azimuth.

 

[digi247]

Hi digi, make sure your azimuth is spot on - I had the same problem, losing signal either side of the arc depending on whether the motor's pole clamp (or in my case the pole itself) was a few millimetres out either side of the correct azimuth. It was enough to throw my alignment out.

I have tried both they are spot on all my east side from 57 right through to around 18 west are the same figures i had before its just past 18 west to 30 west where i seem to be having the problem

Assuming the pole is plumb...

To get a good signal on 30ºW do you have to pull the dish up or let it down? If you have to raise it your motor is slightly east of due south and if you have to lower the elevation of the dish the motor is too far west. Chances are it is 1mm or less that you need to move it.

I have to raise it slightly and i do mean slightly, but when i do the absolute minimal adjustment and get it right from around 7 west through to 57 east are all out completely.

Hi digi247 can you upload a picture?
Are you using the Moteck option, for fine tuning, or like aceb the gibertini option?

No i have the same as Llew's with the adjuster on top, I made sure everything was level my pole is 100% all sides so i know its not that, i put a spirit level on the plate when i put it on the dish and thats level also, It really is a mind you know what LOL. I have spent around 20 hours over 2 days trying to get this to work and what ever adjustment i try everytime its always 30 west thats out.

Thanks

 

[aceb]

Is it only 30W that is out and everything else from 57E to 45?W is OK including 28E?

 

[digi247]

Is it only 30W that is out and everything else from 57E to 45?W is OK including 28E?

No i have not got that far up to 45 west only around to 27 west but i noticed that the dip in signal started from around 18 west

 

[aceb]

I have to raise it slightly and i do mean slightly, but when i do the absolute minimal adjustment and get it right from around 7 west through to 57 east are all out completely.

I could be totally wrong here because my PM experience is minimal so wait for someone who knows about setting up motors to offer the correct advise but it sounds to me that the azimuth is still slightly out as well as the elevation/inclination. The whole thing needs moving very very slightly west until you have the same elevation error on each side then start adjusting your oop and down bits. Apologies if I'm barking up the wrong tree

I know this bit wont help at all but I've been there when no matter what you do ends up with a problem on one side or the other, I've always found it easier to go back to square one and start again, generally the next day!

 

[purplemarina]

Digi, did you source that 76mm pole locally or from a national supplier and how much was it and where did the brackets come from? I need to replace my scaf pole and TKs with something more substantial but we don't have any metal suppliers locally so it's difficult to get prices, online stockists either don't give prices or their sites are a minefield of different gauges.

Try: metals4u.co.uk 76mmx3.2x6m=£85 free del, other sizes are availible. 10swg=3.2mm, 12swg=2.6mm

 

[Mickha]

What is your reading, on the Moteck adjuster, the red arrows, in the picture?


To fine tune, the arc, you need to move the dish back to the true south satellite, you aligned the motor on, then adjust the bracket, where the red arrows are, to the next mark on the scale, re-adjust the main screw thread, to maximise your signal, on one of the weaker transponders, on your true south satellite, then send the dish to the furthest East, and West, satellite, check the signal quality readings and if not perfect go back to your true south satellite and adjust it again.

Eventually you should get the dish tracking the satellite arc.

 

[digi247]

What is your reading, on the Moteck adjuster, the red arrows, in the picture?
View attachment 49497

To fine tune, the arc, you need to move the dish back to the true south satellite, you aligned the motor on, then adjust the bracket, where the red arrows are, to the next mark on the scale, re-adjust the main screw thread, to maximise your signal, on one of the weaker transponders, on your true south satellite, then send the dish to the furthest East, and West, satellite, check the signal quality readings and if not perfect go back to your true south satellite and adjust it again.

Eventually you should get the dish tracking the satellite arc.

Thanks for the reply Mickha, i have decided to give it a rest for a few days and try again with a fresh perspective i know its slightly out but its a nightmare to adjust when its so high up as well not the easiest of jobs LOL.

I will let you know ho i go on.

Cheers.

 

[Mickha]

I completely understand. I now have a ground mounted system, and due to the weather I haven't fine tuned the arc yet. As a temporary fix you can try sending the dish to 30W and just adjust the main bolt, enough to increase the signal, then test all your other satellites. This is a compromise, and you might lose a little signal quality on other satellites, but it worked for me.