Astra 1N tests - latest chat

[Pietclock]

I think 1N's mission at 28.2 is the same 2C is doing right now at 19.2 - providing backup !

On both positions, there are a number of very old satellites which can fail at any time, and to reduce the risk of loosing transponders, SES sent a backup sat to every position.
On 19.2 it's 1H which is quite old and could not be replaced by the existing satellites, on 28.2 2D could also fail - and there would be no sat to compensate, and that would be a disaster for SES.

There is obviously no great need for additional capacity on 28.2, maybe half a dozen transponders or so. So what you do with a satellite you dont really need right now ? You play with it, testing new equipment, maybe they are also testing their uplink facilities with it right now, not just the satellite.

2C is also idling around with just 1 TP in use. And this has been the case for months now.

 

[park_gate]

Well there have been a few posts with a very pessimistic point of view to say the least. Whether the people posting that pessimism really believe the full extent of what they post, or are just trying to provoke some sort of emotional response from expats, or both is open to interpretation, but it is true that frequency reuse is possible and on some satellites is already in use. Turksat is one example where there is frequency reuse, but target audiences are located much further apart than the UK/Spain example often cited.

I’m sure your right but now that it looks like the claims of Expats having problems due to tight beams looks like a load-of-rubbish the next question is are the claims of frequency reuse causing problems also a load-of-rubbish.

I’ve done some research into this and it looks like there shouldn’t be a problem except perhaps in Eastern Europe.

I’ve posted some info on it here:
_http://forums.digitalspy.co.uk/showthread.php?p=54275429#post54275429

Terry

PS I've posted it here as live links work!

 

[Analoguesat]

I’m sure your right but now that it looks like the claims of Expats having problems due to tight beams looks like a load-of-rubbish the next question is are the claims of frequency reuse causing problems also a load-of-rubbish.

I’ve done some research into this and it looks like there shouldn’t be a problem except perhaps in Eastern Europe.

I’ve posted some info on it here:
_http://forums.digitalspy.co.uk/showthread.php?p=54275429#post54275429

Terry

Depends where the expats are - the central Mediterranean eastern Europe & Cyprus are already having problems with (some of) the 1N beams. You also have to remember 1N isnt optimised for 28E but for 19E and we know theres a south western bulge on the beam that the new Astra 2's wont have (this bulge is on the earliest 19E coverage map that was released - which was hurredly withdrawn ) , but the later 28E maps have been "sanitised" and its been removed). Therefore Spain will be getting better signals from 1N than they will from the new 2 series.

The frequency reuse issue on the series 2's is an interesting one and it depends which frequencies are doubled up on which beam.. If they use the Eutelsat block (11200-11700 & 12500-12750) then there wont be much of a problem although its anyone guess what Eutelsat would think of their signals being interfered with! If the spots reuse the UK freqs then Cyprus loses any chance whatsoever of getting uk channels on those freqs.

Freq reuse will only affect the eastern end of the Mediterranean from the Middle Eastern spot, the African spots can be discounted as far enough off beam not to cause any problems.

BTW Id like to know where those 2E 2F 2G maps came from on the satlaunch site as I havent seen them released anywhere yet!

 

[Huevos]

I’m sure your right but now that it looks like the claims of Expats having problems due to tight beams looks like a load-of-rubbish the next question is are the claims of frequency reuse causing problems also a load-of-rubbish.

It's only nonsense for us here, which was to be expected, after all we are only 1.5º from the beam centre, but for some people it is a very real problem.

Depends where the expats are - the central Mediterranean eastern Europe & Cyprus are already having problems with (some of) the 1N beams. [...] If the spots reuse the UK freqs then Cyprus loses any chance whatsoever of getting uk channels on those freqs.

Where in the central Mediterranean? Of course Cyprus is going to have problems because it is almost in the Middle East (3500km from the UK and less than 250km from ME). But anyway I think what PG is getting at is up until now it has been argued that frequency reuse is what will ultimately stop Expats getting UK channels and so far that isn't true. Frequency reuse was being sold as some kind of deliberate blocking tactic, as though a person with an 80cm dish would be able to easily receive a channel but is not able because of an overlapping beam. Currently with respect to Cyprus there is no frequency reuse, and no overlapping beams, the limitation is the practicality of an aerial system that is sensitive enough to receive the new spot beam.

 

[solly]

all speculation about spot beam use it even wide beam not cyprus and mideast
it too bad spot beam
but continie post freuqncy and check and symbol rate can be tested out europe beam
:-righton

 

[Analoguesat]

Where in the central Mediterranean?

Crete - Chania to be precise - we have had one report from there - he can get what we think was the wide beam test

 

[Dan Dan]

Once 2E, F and G are all in place SES can heavily market 28.2E to the Middle East and African markets so over time they'll require all UK based transponders to be on spotbeams to avoid interference I guess.

what like the NIGERIA spotbeams off 2B ...have they caused problems...nope...
and the ARABS have there own satellite systems,owned by ARABS and run by ARABS for ARAB tv.....its callled ....wait for it

ARABSAT ...I WATCH IT ALL THE TIME

it has all the american programs that are on SKY - free and in the clear INCLUDING FILMS

cost €35 box and €30 60cm dish..

very long url deleted coz I cant be bothered to fix it - admin


and they already reuse freq...look here 12.265H at 26e used TWICE

once for IRAN and once for the MAGHREB

-http://www.arabsat.com/pages/Satellite.aspx?sid=17&pid=80

 

[Analoguesat]

TT Please dont post live links to external sites

 

[welshman234]

I think the only way to stop expat viewing is via a a ka sat type arrangement and this isnt going to happen given the practical problems...

 

[Huevos]

I think the only way to stop expat viewing is via a a ka sat type arrangement and this isnt going to happen given the practical problems...

As long as there are Slingboxes, VPNs, or iPlayer there is no point spending millions on new spot beam technology just to try to deny access to a handful of expats.

 

[welshman234]

Huevos I have just read that the expat population in France and Spain is 1.1 million ......bigger than I expected. Ex Pat viewing is big business for Sky...whatever happens with BBC and ITV etc ...Sky sports etc will always be there for the proverbial Rose and Crown in Spain...

 

[satesco]

10964 H 22000 5/6 QPSK DVB-S - Intermittent Signal Lock - No Services - European Widebeam
11053 H 22000 5/6 QPSK DVB-S - Intermittent Signal Lock - No Services - European Widebeam
11127 V 22000 2/3 8PSK DVB-S2 - Solid Signal Lock - Channel 4 HD - UK Spot Beam
11165 H 1000 5/6 QPSK DVB-S - Solid Signal Lock - No Services - European Widebeam
11171 H 22000 5/6 QPSK DVB-S - Currently Off Air - Various Sky Channels - European Widebeam

There are two European Widebeam on Astra 1N.Which of these two European beam you speak:beam 1L or 2beam L? In Eastern Europe we pick up only the signal-11165 H-from 2beam L now.I think you mean second beam when you say Widebeam,that has a footprint greater than the first, as you can see from the map?!
Maybe it's better to specify which of these two beam is really Widebeam when we talk.Not incidentally SES specified three spots.

 

[gfi]

Thought I would bring all the 1N TP info into a single post, so here is the current state of play for Astra 1N as of 15:30 today.

10964 H 22000 5/6 QPSK DVB-S - Intermittent Signal Lock - No Services - European Widebeam
11053 H 22000 5/6 QPSK DVB-S - Intermittent Signal Lock - No Services - European Widebeam
11127 V 22000 2/3 8PSK DVB-S2 - Solid Signal Lock - Channel 4 HD - UK Spot Beam
11165 H 1000 5/6 QPSK DVB-S - Solid Signal Lock - No Services - European Widebeam
11171 H 22000 5/6 QPSK DVB-S - Currently Off Air - Various Sky Channels - European Widebeam

I'm not sure. 10964 and 11053 TPs - we are getting poor signal (look at Location), only. In the night's going down or no lock status (OP125), over daytime is better...
C4HD have similar strength like these two TPs (little higher, but not much).

So, I don't think, there's EU Widebeam. Still looks like UK spotbeam. Of course, I know, they are still switchin' modulation, but when is on (QPSK), signal is much lower in compare to other TPs from EU1, 2A....

 

[woborny]

11127 V 22000 2/3 8PSK DVB-S2 - Solid Signal Lock - Channel 4 HD - UK Spot Beam

Strangely if this is the UK Spot beam, then why can I receive this on my 80cm dish where I am with no problems? Thats not really a UK only spot beam if reception is that easy.
The only one I had issues with was the one with E4HD on - 12324 - which wasn not on my 80cm dish, but was on my 1.8m dish.

 

[Analoguesat]

We need to remember that Astra 1N isnt configured for 28E - shes set up for 19E.

The first set of coverage maps had a distinct bulge to the south west which was "sanitised" off the later maps. The spot beam isnt really representative over western Europe, but from what we have seen so far does drop off very steeply to the east.

12324 is 2B north beam.

 

[tojo-mojo]

Morning Forum,

firstly excuse my stupid question, i just wanted to ask quickly I have been enjoying itv1 channel 4/5/5usa etc (no bbc channels by the way) for the past 9 months on a 1.5m dish (slight over kill for what i needed) here in sunny caserta just south of naples. i woke up yesterday morning to find my sky box off turning it on "no signal" is displayed on the screen now. i have been following various threads now for a couple of months regarding channels going off air, is time time for me to take down the dish and and give to the local scrap man as i cant seem to get a signal or do i leave well alone for the time being and see how it all plans out. Any thoughts would be fantastic.

 

[Analoguesat]

Morning Forum,

firstly excuse my stupid question, i just wanted to ask quickly I have been enjoying itv1 channel 4/5/5usa etc (no bbc channels by the way) for the past 9 months on a 1.5m dish (slight over kill for what i needed) here in sunny caserta just south of naples. i woke up yesterday morning to find my sky box off turning it on "no signal" is displayed on the screen now. i have been following various threads now for a couple of months regarding channels going off air, is time time for me to take down the dish and and give to the local scrap man as i cant seem to get a signal or do i leave well alone for the time being and see how it all plans out. Any thoughts would be fantastic.

You have been watching the encrypted wide-beam versions of these channels

We think they will be moving to the 1N narrow-beam at some point so you may well lose them.

However leave the dish up for now as we dont really know how well the 1N signals will get out.

 

[Dan Dan]

Huevos I have just read that the expat population in France and Spain is 1.1 million ......bigger than I expected. Ex Pat viewing is big business for Sky...whatever happens with BBC and ITV etc ...Sky sports etc will always be there for the proverbial Rose and Crown in Spain...

Yes and most have NO JOBS but a LOT OF MONEY Because they are OAPs..
there are less and less working age brits in spain,they gone back home to claim the dole..
even the children of brits when reaching 16 are going to england,and not staying here

 

[Dan Dan]

We need to remember that Astra 1N isnt configured for 28E - shes set up for 19E.

The first set of coverage maps had a distinct bulge to the south west which was "sanitised" off the later maps. The spot beam isnt really representative over western Europe, but from what we have seen so far does drop off very steeply to the east.

as i said before the bulge for satellites at 19e is to cover the canaries,which BY SPANISH LAW has to be covered to be classed as a NATIONAL broadcaster.

 

[Analoguesat]

as i said before the bulge for satellites at 19e is to cover the canaries,which BY SPANISH LAW has to be covered to be classed as a NATIONAL broadcaster.

Yes - and that bulge is going to have the secondary effect of putting good uk signals into western Spain / Portugal whilst 1N is slotted at 28E