Join our F1 Fantasy League 2009

[wod]

All but one of the eight teams that failed to score centuries today did so because of the 75 points penalty for being over-budget, so please do transfer out those Brawn GP elements before the German Grand Prix

i think that was me, better go and change it now before i forget.

 

[Analoguesat]

Please leave them - Ive got a chance to make a few places up

 

[The Feedster]

Hot from Planet F1 News

Bernie Ecclestone insists there were no winners in Wednesday's deal between FOTA and the FIA, despite the former getting pretty much everything they demanded and more."

With the threat of a breakaway series on the cards, which saw Ecclestone facing the lose of his £1.5billion per year empire, the F1 supremo sat down with FOTA chairman Luca di Montezemolo and Max Mosley to thrash out a deal.

The announcement finally came on Wednesday afternoon with Mosley informing the world that next year there will be just one Championship, it will be run under this year's regulations and that he will step down from his role of FIA President in October.

But while that may seem that FOTA got everything they wanted, Ecclestone says it was a compromise and not a win/lose outcome.

"No winners, just a good compromise," said the 78-year-old.

"I'm obviously very, very happy common sense has prevailed which I've always believed it would because the alternative was not good at all," remarked the 78-year-old.

"I also must say I'm very, very, very happy the teams have come to their senses to stop spending large amounts of money."
More...

 

[Salty25]

DEADLINE - SATURDAY 10:00 BST (10am) / 11:00 CET​

Please make changes to your team lineup for the Grosser Preis Santander von Deutschland.

To make changes, including qualifying predictions which must be submitted prior to every race, access the league homepage.​

F1 SupaLiga | Full Game Rules for Pure Fantasy F1 | List of TV Broadcasters | LIVE and delayed coverage from BBC
(All PFF1 pages are also visible in German)​

German Grand Prix timetable:
Times in BST, Nurburgring = BST +1
Friday Practice 1 - 09:00-10:30
Friday Practice 2 - 13:00-14:30
Saturday Practice - 10:00-11:00
Saturday Qualifying - 13:00​

Sunday Race - 13:00

 

[The Feedster]

Hot from F1.com

Mark Webber ultimately took his first pole position after a gripping shootout which saw the Australian, Red Bull team mate Sebastian Vettel, the Brawns of Rubens Barrichello and Jenson Button and Lewis Hamilton's McLaren all in contention for the top slot. First it was Hamilton's. Then Button's, before Webber's 1m 32.230s put him ahead. Vettel's 1m 32.480s momentarily placed him second before Button's 1m 32.473s earned him P2, before Barrichello beat that...

More...

 

[Salty25]

[fieldset=Race report provided via The Feedster - Aussie rules! Webber romps to victory in Germany] Hot from F1.com

"Mark Webber you are a Grand Prix winner. Well done! Brilliant drive!" Those words, from Red Bull's engineers, told you all you needed to know about Sunday's German Grand Prix at the Nurburgring.No matter what they threw at the Australian, including a drive-through penalty for a brush off the startline with Brawn's Rubens Barrichello, Webber came through and delivered his first F1 victory in devastating style...

More... [/fieldset]
Race Result | Driver Standings | Team Standings


F1 SupaLiga 2009

Full table and graph attached​

Mark Webber claimed his maiden victory in 8 years as a Formula 1 driver, as Red Bull made it 1-2 again with Sebastian Vettel finishing 2nd to pile the pressure on Jenson Button and Brawn GP. The Aussie started in pole but had a bad start when off the start he appeared to move aggressive towards Ruben Barrichello, resulting in a drive-through penalty. However, Brawn GP’s three stop strategy played into Red Bull’s hands as the predicted rain never fell and left Brawn GP having too much time to make up. When everything shook out, Webber was head and shoulders above the rest and deserved his first ever win.

Today’s race heralded a new leader this season in F1 SupaLiga – me! With a top score of 164pts, my Auto-Dynamo team have taken top spot for the first time since the European GP last season. Dazdazdazzy’s BTTR have fallen to 2nd, and now share the PFF1 Cup places with Topper and his Tossers. Honda-Williams, managed by kleefarr, have gone down from 1st to 4th in the space of two races.

There was lots of movement elsewhere, including debutant manager bite who is now up to 5th with his team, Superkomanda, whilst 2007 champion Norm and 2008 champion Oily are up to 7th and 8th respectively.


NEXT RACE > HUNGARIAN GP @ HUNGARORING > JULY 26

 

[Oily]

whilst 2007 champion Norm and 2008 champion Oily are up to 7th and 8th respectively.

You mean joint 7th ;)

Tell you what,between #3 & #10 spot,it's very very close

 

[Topper]

You mean joint 7th ;)

Tell you what,between #3 & #10 spot,it's very very close

Yes I can feel the hounds sniffing my derriere

 

[Salty25]

You mean joint 7th ;)

Tell you what,between #3 & #10 spot,it's very very close

Technically no, as Norm has a lower positional index - basically, his lower on count-back (don't ask me how that's worked out exactly, bit of a black art if you ask me ).

Definitely, two great weekends and you're right up there. I don't want to call it as a two horse race for the title, especially considering that I'd be one of them, but I think it's fair to say it's not far off.

 

[Topper]

I don't want to call it as a two horse race for the title, especially considering that I'd be one of them, but I think it's fair to say it's not far off.

Yes I would say you are correct in your comment, but it is because the re-classification IMHO was a little unfair since it was only applied to one team, all that happened was that such as yourself could afford to switch to all Red Bull componants because the value of your team increased by some 50%, most others including myself could not afford that selection however, equally the likes of Ferrari and McLaren who only this weekend have shown any promise this season are valued so high as to make them almost unaffordable, so we will never catch you two up. What should have happened, which I thought was happening was that all team components, drivers and managers should have been re-classified at that point in time based on season performance so far, and the rule applied which again was mentioned about limiting the number of team components in a selection i.e. only one driver from a team, or no more than three components from the same team.

 

[Norm]

all that happened was that such as yourself could afford to switch to all Red Bull componants because the value of your team increased by some 50%, most others including myself could not afford that selection

I don't think you are correct there - most of us could have managed a switch to all Red Bull if we had wanted to (fools that we were for not doing it!!). And the value of Salty's team didn't increase by 50%; the cost of the Brawn team increased by 50% - meaning he could no longer have all Brawn components (there is quite a difference).

 

[Topper]

I don't think you are correct there - most of us could have managed a switch to all Red Bull if we had wanted to (fools that we were for not doing it!!). And the value of Salty's team didn't increase by 50%; the cost of the Brawn team increased by 50% - meaning he could no longer have all Brawn components (there is quite a difference).

Whilst I did say Salty's team I did mean the Brawn team Norm, but as Salty's team was all Brawn anyway I think it is splitting a hair or two but I do stand corrected.

Well I cannot speak for others but all Red Bull was never a financially viable option for me personally. Indeed despite my 3rd position which was not gained on my merit more on other's failures, I still have the lowest team value within the top ten places and do not realistically understand why and still maintain that the way the adjustment was applied was incorrect.

 

[Norm]

Whilst I did say Salty's team I did mean the Brawn team Norm, but as Salty's team was all Brawn anyway I think it is splitting a hair or two but I do stand corrected.

Well I cannot speak for others but all Red Bull was never an financially viable option for me personally. Indeed despite my 3rd position which was not gained on my merit more on other's failures, I still have the lowest team value within the top ten places and do not realistically understand why and still maintain that the way the adjustment was applied was incorrect.

I think what we will have to agree upon is that this season's F1 is a mess because the previous natural order (Ferrari, McLaren, BMW at the top) has been upset by rule changes. Blame Mad Max, I say!

There was no question, as far as our game was concerned, that Brawn required a revaluation. There is now an argument that Red Bull requires the same although the "reality" gap is not as big as it was with Brawn, but the Red Bull components still look too cheap and maybe the Brawn's are a touch expensive. My sympathy goes out to Maverick who has to administer all of this!

There is a danger if you go the all eggs in one basket route of all Red Bull, that if one driver fails to finish the race (and this may be through no fault of his own), that this has quite an effect on the total score. The leaders could still suffer because of this - although it might require this to happen in a few races, and for them to stick with all Red Bull, of course.

We don't know the value of your team because you are "Top Secret", so we will take your word that you have the lowest value team in the top 10. £136 M was required for an all Red Bull team after the Brawn revaluation and I think a lot could have managed that - but I haven't the patience (or inclination!) to work out exactly how many.

 

[Salty25]

I think what we will have to agree upon is that this season's F1 is a mess because the previous natural order (Ferrari, McLaren, BMW at the top) has been upset by rule changes. Blame Mad Max, I say!

There was no question, as far as our game was concerned, that Brawn required a revaluation. There is now an argument that Red Bull requires the same although the "reality" gap is not as big as it was with Brawn, but the Red Bull components still look too cheap and maybe the Brawn's are a touch expensive. My sympathy goes out to Maverick who has to administer all of this!

There is a danger if you go the all eggs in one basket route of all Red Bull, that if one driver fails to finish the race (and this may be through no fault of his own), that this has quite an effect on the total score. The leaders could still suffer because of this - although it might require this to happen in a few races, and for them to stick with all Red Bull, of course.

We don't know the value of your team because you are "Top Secret", so we will take your word that you have the lowest value team in the top 10. £136 M was required for an all Red Bull team after the Brawn revaluation and I think a lot could have managed that - but I haven't the patience (or inclination!) to work out exactly how many.

Without wanting to give too much away, I believe that Red Bull's reliability is as good as Brawn GP, in other words pretty darn good! By this logic, I've gone with an all-Red Bull set-up. External factors such as DNFs through crashes caused by other drivers is a part of F1, and can happen to any driver.

There is of course no guarantee that there will be a Brawn-Red Bull fight out until the end. The McLaren's looked very strong in Germany, and if Hamilton hadn't had such a disasterous start than he may even have won yesterday. McLaren's KERS system is perfection. I still find it hard to believe that Ferrari won't come back to form in the latter stages of the season as well.

In my defence, and those that went for all-Brawn early on, I'd argue that we've been awarded for realising that Brawn were almost unbeatable in the first handful of races and so we've been duly awarded with extra money.

I do agree though that from next season, no one should be allowed to have more than 3 components from any one team. My team selection is arguable not within the spirit of the game, but like everything in F1, if it's just within the rules it's the way to go IMO.

 

[Topper]

We don't know the value of your team because you are "Top Secret", so we will take your word that you have the lowest value team in the top 10. £136 M was required for an all Red Bull team after the Brawn revaluation and I think a lot could have managed that - but I haven't the patience (or inclination!) to work out exactly how many.

Yes I had forgotten I had wasted a point on that for the next race which I have 140 for, at changeover race 8, I had 131 which was not enough but that fact can of course be seen by looking back at my stats for race 8.

But no it is only a game and I do appreciate the amount of time and effort both Jason and Maverick put in to provide this entertainment. As I have mentioned before and I think Rolf did, I would have thought the answer was to re-evaluated after every race to make it fair and indeed next year we could potentially have all this problem again with 3 new teams entering and more new regulations, but perhaps if Maverick brings in the 3 component rule next year there will not be such a big problem

 

[MaverickF1]

I agree, it isn't a satisfying Pure Fantasy F1 season so far, because of the new balance of power in the real Formula 1.

I wasn't really prepared for this situation. I tried to save the season with the extraordinary adjustment of the Brawn GP component costs after race 7. Unfortunately the action haven't worked very well, because many team owners were able to switch from Brawn GP to Red Bull components.

The reasons why the reprising action almost failed are:

- It was too late in the season
- The team budgets were already too high
- I adjusted only the prices of the Brawn GP components (and not the prices of all other components too)

The positive aspect is, that I have gained experience for the next year and I have available a new powerful feature to correct component prices during the season.

What should I do, to prevent such a situation in the next season?

The suggestion to bring in a '3 components rule' is a good one, at first sight.
But would it solve the problem? I am afraid not.
Please take a look at this season. If we apply this rule (without a reprising of component costs of course), what would be the difference? Instead of all Brawn GP or all Red Bull teams, we would have mixed teams with Brawn GP and Red Bull components.
But the main problem wouldn't be solved: no real team budget limitations and too fast rising team budgets.
That's why I think that a '3 components rule' won't be the answer.

Currently I intend to go in this direction:

An obligatory extraordinary adjustment of ALL component costs after race 3.

The team budgets don't vary that much in the first 3 races and the general performance of the Formula 1 teams is foreseeable. After that reprising action the restricted team budgets won't allow the selection of all components from a F1 top team.

At the moment I think, as long as the component prices are in a realistic range, a '3 components rule' won't be necessary.

What do you believe? I am looking forward to read your feedback.

Kind regards
Maverick

 

[Norm]

Hi Maverick. Thank you for taking the time to explain your thoughts on game improvement for next season. I agree with you regarding the three component rule. I think that this should be self regulating to the extent that it shouldn't be possible to overdose on the best teams at the start because of funding restrictions.

I am not averse to your proposal for an extraordinary adjustment. The only downside I see is that there are some participants who are probably less active in changing their teams. If they happen to have a component that's revised upwards and they don't change their team, they take a penalty. Is there some way around this to soften the blow, do you think? I'm concerned that the penalty may be disproportionate to the offence for some players. Of course, it may be impossible to do anything about this.

Hopefully next season, we may have clearer rules in F1 and some form of natural order restored so these adjustments are not required. Good game you have devised, by the way - even with this season's glitch!

 

[MaverickF1]

I am not averse to your proposal for an extraordinary adjustment. The only downside I see is that there are some participants who are probably less active in changing their teams. If they happen to have a component that's revised upwards and they don't change their team, they take a penalty. Is there some way around this to soften the blow, do you think? I'm concerned that the penalty may be disproportionate to the offence for some players. Of course, it may be impossible to do anything about this.

Hi Norm!

I have at the moment two ideas regarding to the penalty points for teams with a negative cash balance:

1.) Dynamic penalty points:

(Negative cash balance) x 2 = penalty points (max. 75)


2.) Automatically team component changes:

A team owner will be able to activate a new feature 'Clear negative cash balance by automatically team component changes'.

This feature would make team component changes after the database closing time in order to achieve a zero or positive cash balance with the help of the PFF1 prediction points.

It will be definitely a challenge to write an adequate routine, which will be able to perform intelligent team component changes.


I think this could be a passable solution also for quite inactive players.

 

[Salty25]

Hi Maverick, it's great to see you posting and letting us know what's going on

I absolutely agree with your argument for why 3 component limiting is a bad idea. The extraordinary cost adjustment seems much fairer and viable as an option. I fully support it.

As for those managers who fail to change their team following such an extradordinary adjustment, and therefore incuring the huge penalty, I think another possibility is that if their team cost is above budget, then their team should be changed automatically to select the cheapest (worst) components following the adjustment. I'd imagine this would be easy to do and would keep them 'in the game'.

 

[Salty25]

DEADLINE - SATURDAY 10:00 BST (10am) / 11:00 CET

Please make changes to your team lineup for the ING Magyar Nagydij Hungarian Grand Prix.

To make changes, including qualifying predictions which must be submitted prior to every race, access the league homepage.​

F1 SupaLiga | Full Game Rules for Pure Fantasy F1 | List of TV Broadcasters | LIVE and delayed coverage from BBC
(All PFF1 pages are also visible in German)​

Hungarian Grand Prix timetable:
Times in BST, Budapest = BST +1
Friday Practice 1 - 09:00-10:30
Friday Practice 2 - 13:00-14:30
Saturday Practice - 10:00-11:00
Saturday Qualifying - 13:00​

Sunday Race - 13:00