New NS2000 (NS3 / NS4) thread

[moonbase]

Isn't receiving the signal just part 1 though? I assume the feeds inside are still BISS, and then couldn't they just use BISS CA and then thats it really made impossible.

Perhaps the broadcasters think that Novelsat modulation followed by a DRM underneath followed by Tandberg or standard biss underneath is enough to keep it secure?

 

[itchybag]

Yes, but this receiver (and the way used to make upgrades) is not intended for the average guy in the street.

there only so much a hobbiest can do. It would be nice to know a guy, who knows a guy..............

the ns3000's on ebay will be of no use to anyone without an upgrade path, sadly.

 

[ralf111]

perhaps they know that something can be wrong with their security ,and they trying to say... ok don't worry everything is safe until they charge for that ton of millions $$$,using biss-ca and other methods like tandberg doesn't make sense at all if their peopertiary system can be hacked ,

but i don't know i only quess is that they think this way

 

[itchybag]

Perhaps the broadcasters think that Novelsat modulation followed by a DRM underneath followed by Tandberg or standard biss underneath is enough to keep it secure?

if the broadcaster were that bothered i think they would have stopped using BISS a decade ago.

 

[ralf111]

have look on that ,did you ever seen it ?

HIGH-SPEED SATELLITE MODEMS

SatExpander satellite modems feature ultra-high-performance for telecom, broadcast, enterprise and government data intensive applications. Delivering very high throughputs and efficiencies, the SE3000, SE330 & SE350 satellite modems provide superior Point-to-Point and Point-to-Multi-Point...

www.satexpander.com

is exactly same system called diffrent, but this is exactly the same as NS/NS4

 

[itchybag]

I'm just wondering that to this day no-one has not tried to reverse engineer these receivers. We even don't know what components are used, commonly available or proprietary ones. Most important is demodulator chip or sub-unit.

its a niche market there has to be a enough customers out there to justify the reverse engineering costs.

 

[7mdish]

Still trying to lock the transponder at 12649V, but no way.
Anyone had success?

 

[moonbase]

there only so much a hobbiest can do. It would be nice to know a guy, who knows a guy..............

This stuff does not get served up on a plate, anyone wanting access who is outside of the broadcasting industry has to do some work and research, sometimes lots of it.

 

[moonbase]

have look on that ,did you ever seen it ?

HIGH-SPEED SATELLITE MODEMS

SatExpander satellite modems feature ultra-high-performance for telecom, broadcast, enterprise and government data intensive applications. Delivering very high throughputs and efficiencies, the SE3000, SE330 & SE350 satellite modems provide superior Point-to-Point and Point-to-Multi-Point...

www.satexpander.com

is exactly same system called diffrent, but this is exactly the same as NS/NS4

Would you know if they they rebadged Novelsat units that use Novelsat tech?
Or is it a different type of modulation?

 

[itchybag]

Would you know if they they rebadged Novelsat units that use Novelsat tech?
Or is it a different type of modulation?

mentions ns4 in the documentation. Is it a way of novelsat to sell more units and pay less tax by having 2 companies lowing the tax threshold?

 

[7mdish]

That's for Feedsat

if you can't publish obvious data for some reason, I mean sr and freq, you should also consider that signing every post and marking photos may cause you big problems, and on the other hand, you shouldn't call it feedhunting since you know all its details as well key, and as an administrator and a person with extensive knowledge, you should not be surprised by posts on this type of forum, as far as I can see, you also delete posts as well as private posts and messages of users who only exchange data regarding freq and sr

I decided to answer you here, but keeping in mind your previous practices, I will publish this post in the same place from which you got my comments,

ps . maybe you should consider staying quiet like you suggested, since publishing data that isn't a secret anyway could get you in trouble


Just to post simple answer for Feedsat who may read that or not ( i'm pretty shure that he will )

that post bellow is Feedsat post on other forum :

UK Board:

PS: if you don't know the truth; if you don't have the entire story, the best to do is to stay quiet (shut (u)p) ! If I do not post parameters, I have good resaons .

I have access to all the Tandberg key legaly!

example with SeireA (xml file secondary key) tandberg AES256.

The same with me today.
He posted a reply on that forum to my post here regarding the feed at 12649V.
Well, I do not like this practice.
As I have no account there (if I want one, I open it on myself), I know about that reply thanks to a member here (thanks a lot! Really!).
I do not believe that we need replies from anyone on different web sites. If someone wants to reply, the best way would be register here and post his/her opinion, isn't it? It is so simple!
Why involving other forums without knowing if the original poster has the chance to read/reply to you?
Very very bad in my opinion.
Last but not least: please Feedsat, do not think that you are the only man in Europe (or in the world....) having such receivers or dishes or devices, or knowing all keys, parameters and so on about satellite feeds. Maybe other people are only more and more quiet than you!
Please note that I will not continue in this debate, I will not read more replies in that board, and I will not reply to you here regarding this topic.
I prefer to continue speaking about satellites, feeds, NS3/NS4, and so on. It is more interesting.
Sorry to the mods for this post but I believe it was needed. Thank you for your patience.

 

[moonbase]

He posted a reply on that forum to my post here regarding the feed at 12649V.
Well, I do not like this practice.

I am not sure what your issue is, all that was done was to post a screen grab to show that 12649V was NS4 and lockable on 7.0E.
You asked on this forum if anyone had locked it, "Feedsat" no longer posts on this forum which is his personal choice so he showed the frequency was lockable on another forum in a topic dedicated to 7.0E and NS3/NS4.

This cross forum chatter is meaningless, please do not be surprised if the forum admins close down this topic or move it to another part of the forum out of general membership visibility.
I requested that this new topic be opened a couple of years ago to replace the old topic that was archived. I do not plan to request another topic be allowed if this one gets closed.

Would contributors to this topic please keep it "on topic" and not refer to activity on other forums?

 

[ralf111]

Would you know if they they rebadged Novelsat units that use Novelsat tech?
Or is it a different type of modulation?

Is exactly same system and the same modulation called different like for example
Ns3 will be called satx3 ,I can’t remember if is exactly satx3 but I checked that system and their units are able to receive ns3 and ns4 ,
The only differences are their system operate at higher voltage ranges but this is not a problem as all other things are exactly the same ,their systems will work whenever you swap them between units ,they must cooperate for sure

 

[moonbase]

Is exactly same system and the same modulation called different like for example
Ns3 will be called satx3 ,I can’t remember if is exactly satx3 but I checked that system and their units are able to receive ns3 and ns4 ,
The only differences are their system operate at higher voltage ranges but this is not a problem as all other things are exactly the same ,their systems will work whenever you swap them between units ,they must cooperate for sure

Thank you for the detailed reply.

 

[Analoguesat]

Moonbase makes a fair point. This topic is supposed to be for discussion of transmissions that those lucky folks who have access to (and know how to use) this kit can find. Plus some technical background stuff - the posts the other day about how NS update the files on the units was interesting. Completely irrelevant to me as I'll never have access to a unit but interesting from a technical point of view. I would have predicited something similar for updating the boxes as its really not much different from us hobbyists flashing our home receivers to update them.

The topic seems to have degenerated into a free for all, so lets get back on topic please.

 

[duaneclaude]

So I bought one the ns3000 that I mentioned. It cost me 1,404 uk pounds including priority shipping plus 144 uk pounds customs. Took 2 days to arrive.
Its in very good condition and the best part is it has ns4 rx licenced.
Very happy.
Last time I looked he had sold 5 of 24.

 

[7mdish]

I can confirm the seond one:
12691V SR 35294, just locked.
Obviously they use DRM, so no chance to decode any service into the mux.
Instead, we are not able to lock 12649V, tested all possible symbol rates between 18000 and 38000, step of 50. No way.
Are you sure it is NS3/NS4? Possibly DVB-S2X?

Finally we found that! The modulation is NS4 and the exact symbol rate is 23530. Probably a step of 50 in the SR research is too high.
Please note that the exact transponder frequency seems 12648V to me, but I can't be sure about the LO value in my LNB, although it is a PLL one by SMW, so a good quality product.
Also, the exact symbol rate of the 12691V transponder is 12590, not 12594.
So, it seems that all the Olympic feeds are there.
At least all feeds by EBU, other than many dedicated feeds for each single broadcaster, probably distributed via fiber or via more satellites that I did not looked at.

 

[moonbase]

Finally we found that! The modulation is NS4 and the exact symbol rate is 23530. Probably a step of 50 in the SR research is too high.

I carried out some tests on the SR lock threshold for an NS3 frequency and found it to be 0.0177 mcps
For example, Locked at SR of 34.2763 mcps, fails to lock at 34.2940 mcps.

I have yet to repeat the SR step test for an NS4 frequency but I expect the threshold to be tighter, requiring smaller step increments to achieve a lock.

The same step principle applies to the frequency but for this I think there is more tolerance?

 

[7mdish]

I carried out some tests on the SR lock threshold for an NS3 frequency and found it to be 0.0177 mcps
For example, Locked at SR of 34.2763 mcps, fails to lock at 34.2940 mcps.

I have yet to repeat the step test for an NS4 frequency but I expect the threshold to be tighter, requiring smaller step increments to achieve a lock.

I think that it does not depend by the modulation type, but by the receiver firmware.
I asked myself for this point today looking for these frequencies. Not sure exactly, but the "lock range" could be around 3 or 4. For example, if the SR is 23530 it is locked from 13528 to 13532. Once locked, the receiver shows the error in PPM form.
This is the reason for which I choose a step of 10 to look at the exact symbol rate. Yesterday I used a step of 50, largely too high. Today using a step of 10 I locked.
The next time that I have the chance to play with that decoder I check and let you know the exact "lock range".

 

[moonbase]

Only on 12539 H, I couldn't find it because I don't know the parameters.

I think 12539H is an NS4 Olympics feed?
A scan with IQmonitor and an S2X card might reveal something?